Re: [DNSOP] [mif] [dnsext] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread teemu.savolainen
Brian, Would the following text be then ok? Please note I changed the domain addition from SHOULD to MAY, if there is going to be attempt to deprecate/redefine/update search list logics. Or do you think it should remain SHOULD? -- 4.6. Interactions with DNS search lists A node may be

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread teemu.savolainen
Brian, Do you agree that nodes' behavioral differences between foo and foo. names is out of the scope of this particular MIF draft? There could perhaps be another draft, which would say that if name is foo it should not be appended with search lists but foo. might? And whatever other differences

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread teemu.savolainen
(resending only to mailing list recipients) Brian, Do you agree that nodes' behavioral differences between foo and foo. names is out of the scope of this particular MIF draft? There could perhaps be another draft, which would say that if name is foo it should not be appended with search lists

Re: [DNSOP] [mif] [dnsext] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Ray Bellis
On 21 Oct 2011, at 08:21, teemu.savolai...@nokia.com teemu.savolai...@nokia.com wrote: Do you agree that nodes' behavioral differences between foo and foo. names is out of the scope of this particular MIF draft? In my view neither the draft nor MIF should be encoding any changes to client

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [dhcwg] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Brian Dickson
I'm not sure where it would belong, exactly, but certainly between best practices and DNSSEC security concerns, is the basic tenet: The DNS is a unified namespace. This leads to a number of potential issues, which can largely be addressed by viewing the issues from the perspective of a unified

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Brian Dickson
I think we can skirt this rat-hole if we separate the two following distinct cases: Case A: foo Case B: foo. (with terminating dot). Case B meets the technical requirements of a Fully Qualified Domain Name, structurally speaking. Case A does not. Case A is a bare name, case B is not. If we

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Mark Andrews
In message CAH1iCiqsN-R87VK3vKityPsY+NXA=0drasyf_vmbsy8gvyw...@mail.gmail.com , Brian Dickson writes: I think we can skirt this rat-hole if we separate the two following distinct cases: Case A: foo Case B: foo. (with terminating dot). Case B meets the technical requirements of a Fully

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Keith Moore
On Oct 21, 2011, at 3:15 AM, teemu.savolai...@nokia.com wrote: Brian, Do you agree that nodes' behavioral differences between foo and foo. names is out of the scope of this particular MIF draft? That's not how I would state it. I think handling of foo. is something that IETF can define,

Re: [DNSOP] [mif] [dnsext] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Keith Moore
On Oct 21, 2011, at 3:15 AM, teemu.savolai...@nokia.com wrote: Brian, Would the following text be then ok? Please note I changed the domain addition from SHOULD to MAY, if there is going to be attempt to deprecate/redefine/update search list logics. Or do you think it should remain

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Ted Lemon
On Oct 21, 2011, at 3:15 AM, teemu.savolai...@nokia.commailto:teemu.savolai...@nokia.com teemu.savolai...@nokia.commailto:teemu.savolai...@nokia.com wrote: There could perhaps be another draft, which would say that if name is foo it should not be appended with search lists but foo. might? And

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Ted Lemon
On Oct 21, 2011, at 10:04 AM, Keith Moore wrote: And honestly I don't see why handling of non-DNS names like foo is in scope for MIF. Because such names are typically resolved using DNS search lists, and at lease one mechanism for setting up search lists is interface-specific.

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Keith Moore
On Oct 21, 2011, at 11:07 AM, Ted Lemon wrote: On Oct 21, 2011, at 3:15 AM, teemu.savolai...@nokia.com teemu.savolai...@nokia.com wrote: There could perhaps be another draft, which would say that if name is foo it should not be appended with search lists but foo. might? And whatever other

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Ted Lemon
On Oct 21, 2011, at 11:13 AM, Keith Moore wrote: IMO: search lists are useful, but only with bare names - and the behavior of those should be implementation dependent. Trying to nail it down will break too much widespread practice. On a desktop workstation they are useful, because you can

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Keith Moore
On Oct 21, 2011, at 11:11 AM, Ted Lemon wrote: On Oct 21, 2011, at 10:04 AM, Keith Moore wrote: And honestly I don't see why handling of non-DNS names like foo is in scope for MIF. Because such names are typically resolved using DNS search lists, and at lease one mechanism for

Re: [DNSOP] [dnsext] [mif] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Keith Moore
On Oct 21, 2011, at 11:19 AM, Ted Lemon wrote: On Oct 21, 2011, at 11:13 AM, Keith Moore wrote: IMO: search lists are useful, but only with bare names - and the behavior of those should be implementation dependent. Trying to nail it down will break too much widespread practice. On a

Re: [DNSOP] [mif] [dnsext] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread teemu.savolainen
Now that more people are involved in discussions, this bare name / DNS search list area seems to look like quite a deep swamp without clear IETF consensus. Perhaps we should discuss first if this particular topic (=section 4.6) is needed in this document at all, because, after all, the focus is

Re: [DNSOP] [mif] [dnsext] 2nd Last Call for MIF DNS server selection document

2011-10-21 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Teemu, I think that the spirit of what you propose is correct, but as Keith points out it really isn't appropriate to use RFC 2119 language about a pragmatic approach that clearly lies outside the definition of the DNS namespace. If an implementor is willing to take the risk of transforming