Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-09-03 Thread Claus Reinke
Thanks everyone for your feedback! I certainly learned a thing or two, but the majority opinion and information seem to be: - further divergence is in the cards for AS and ES - AS and ES are already so different that, wrt input to ES development, AS has no special status over other

Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-09-02 Thread Peter van der Zee
On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 2:30 AM, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.org wrote: You really should read back in es-discuss if you have time (understand if you don't!). We covered what made ES4 fail. The main problem was namespaces, upon which packages were built. Unfortunately, AS3 uses namespaces

Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-09-02 Thread Brendan Eich
Peter van der Zee wrote: On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 2:30 AM, Brendan Eichbren...@mozilla.org wrote: You really should read back in es-discuss if you have time (understand if you don't!). We covered what made ES4 fail. The main problem was namespaces, upon which packages were built.

Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-08-29 Thread Alex Russell
What Brendan said. Let me just add this: Flash isn't about AS3 (particularly). It's an entire environment, event model, rich library of APIs, and a deep toolchain that allows developers to be productive. Even if we were to adopt the (foolish) goal of adding missing AS3 features to ES, that

Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-08-29 Thread Claus Reinke
Since this seems to be open to misinterpretation: I'm looking at this from a JS developer perspective, and since ES4 failed, I was *not* asking to make ES6 any more like AS3. What I thought would be interesting can be reduced to two points: 1. promoting ES6 to AS3 developers, so that they do

Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-08-29 Thread Alex Russell
On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 10:05 AM, Claus Reinke claus.rei...@talk21.comwrote: Since this seems to be open to misinterpretation: I'm looking at this from a JS developer perspective, and since ES4 failed, I was *not* asking to make ES6 any more like AS3. What I thought would be interesting can

Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-08-29 Thread Avik Chaudhuri
As one of the designers of AS4 (the next version of ActionScript), I can say that we are looking not only to (1) remove awkward ES4 features that come in the way of simplicity and performance, but also to (2) limit dynamic features and boost static features at the same time. (We have our

Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-08-29 Thread Brendan Eich
Hi Avik, Totally cool to push static, not a bone of contention. What you write here and in reply to Alex for me cements the point that we should not treat AS3 developers as potential hand-coders of ES6. Alex is right, Flash developers are not ready to switch programming languages *and*

Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-08-28 Thread Claus Reinke
Hope this isn't politically inappropriate here;-) 1. Flash is dying as a browser plugin, but otherwise still alive, especially with compilation of Actionscript to native code [2,3]. 2. Adobe has been growing support for HTML/Javascript options. 3. Actionscript is based on an old ES draft

Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-08-28 Thread Brendan Eich
Claus Reinke wrote: Hope this isn't politically inappropriate here;-) 1. Flash is dying as a browser plugin, but otherwise still alive, especially with compilation of Actionscript to native code [2,3]. 2. Adobe has been growing support for HTML/Javascript options. 3. Actionscript is based

Re: Convergence options for Ecmascript/Actionscript?

2012-08-28 Thread Rick Waldron
On Tue, Aug 28, 2012 at 8:30 PM, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.org wrote: Claus Reinke wrote: Hope this isn't politically inappropriate here;-) 1. Flash is dying as a browser plugin, but otherwise still alive, especially with compilation of Actionscript to native code [2,3]. 2. Adobe