Re: [FRIAM] Subjectivity and cartoons

2016-03-03 Thread Nick Thompson
Russ, I am torn between judging your cartoon comment as silly or profound. I have said that if a robot could be devised that was embedded in a social network of other robots, that systematically avoided injurious events and stimuli, that engaged in some communicative behavior when

Re: [FRIAM] Subjectivity and square roots

2016-03-03 Thread Nick Thompson
Well, Russ, now, I think you might be ready to see (be the only one to see?) the force of my making an analogy between the first derivative of a function and the motivation of a behavior. One can see and touch increasingly accurate approximations to it, but one can never see and touch the

[FRIAM] Subjectivity and cartoons

2016-03-03 Thread Russ Abbott
Nick (and I think Eric) said that a sufficiently convincing performance of pain behavior by a robot is pain. I asked whether a sufficiently convincing animated depiction of pain behavior via a cartoon is also pain? In other words, can a cartoonist create pain by drawing it? In asking that I don't

Re: [FRIAM] Subjectivity and square roots

2016-03-03 Thread Russ Abbott
Since Glen missed the square root analogy, I'd like to repeat it. Nick and Eric seem to be saying that there is no such thing as subjective experience since only things that can be seen and touched are real. I said that such a position seems to deny the existence of the square root of two. One

[FRIAM] FW: Ting Internet

2016-03-03 Thread Nick Thompson
Hi, everybody, Many of you will recall that a representative of Ting Internet visited with "the local chapter" last Friday, hosted by my friend Sean Moody, who works for the City. Ting is a Canadian business whose business model includes bringing fiber to cities like Santa Fe. I asked Sean

Re: [FRIAM] Subjectivity, intimacy, experience

2016-03-03 Thread glen
On 03/02/2016 12:07 PM, Russ Abbott wrote: Thanks Glen. For me even the state machine isn't quite enough. A state machine version wouldn't even in principle distinguish between a robot/zombie and a living being. I don't understand why you think state machines are inadequate for making the