>= Original Message From "Jared Angell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> =
>
>If a word such a geodesic dome requires this much debate then if the
>language suddenly had 1,000,000 speakers how would anyone ever be able to
>get anything across on a specific topic.
[snip]
>Being able to say 'geodesic do
>= Original Message From "Jared Angell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> =
>So 'rekyboldi'u' could be used to describe the class of all geodesic
>domes...but now I have learned that the type of geodome i was referring to
>is the specific type made of triangles (and what if I mean the type with
>windows,
Yes, I agree. You can use a fu'ivla or a tanru or even a quote {gy geodesic
dome gy}. You don't need to define a lujvo for every concept.
On 10/29/07, Isen hand <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> <<"geodesic dome" is a concept that's used rarely in speech and in
> writing. >>
>
> Isn't than then an a
From: Yoav Nir <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Sent: Monday, 29 October, 2007 8:36:54 AM
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: geodesic dome
I agree. IMO "geodesic dome" is a concept that's used rarely in speech and in
writing. That's why English uses two
I agree. IMO "geodesic dome" is a concept that's used rarely in speech and
in writing. That's why English uses two words ("geodesic" and "dome"). If
this was something we talked about every day, there would probably be some
combination like "geo-dome" with or without the hyphen.
Similarly in Lojba
On 10/28/07, der Mouse <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > I'm quickly discovering that the Lojban community is a group of
> > people that don't take the language more seriously really than as a
> > intellectual game which my level is apparently zero in and therefore
> > I don't have a right to discus
> I'm quickly discovering that the Lojban community is a group of
> people that don't take the language more seriously really than as a
> intellectual game which my level is apparently zero in and therefore
> I don't have a right to discuss the weaknesses and problems of the
> game that could be wo
Point taken.
On 10/28/07, Robert LeChevalier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Pierre Abbat wrote:
> > Whatever we decide to call a geodesic dome, we need to distinguish it
> from
> > other kinds of domes, which may be constructed with geodesics, but in a
> > different arrangement.
>
> Why do we *nee
Pierre Abbat wrote:
> Whatever we decide to call a geodesic dome, we need to distinguish it from
> other kinds of domes, which may be constructed with geodesics, but in a
> different arrangement.
Why do we *need* to do so?
> A few days ago I watched a video about the
> construction of what is n
On Saturday 27 October 2007 11:30, Jorge Llambías wrote:
> bol- is relevant both for "geodesic" and for "dome", but
> {bol(sfe)sirji bol(di'u)dru} for "geodesic dome" sounds a bit redundant.
> You can probably shorten it to {bolsirji drudi} or even {bolsirdru}.
Whatever we decide to call a geodesi
I'm quickly discovering that the Lojban community is a group of people that
don't take the language more seriously really than as a intellectual game
which my level is apparently zero in and therefore I don't have a right to
discuss the weaknesses and problems of the game that could be worked on.
Jorge Llambías said:
Can it also be used for the earth? Because that's what the geo- part
> of geodesic means.
Yes.
On 10/26/07, Penguino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Geodesic is a little more difficult - my dictionary gives 测地线 for "geodesic
> line". 地 = ground,
Can it also be used for the earth? Because that's what the geo- part
of geodesic means.
> 线 = line, but 测 is a new word to me. The dictionary gives
On Oct 27, 2007, at 8:43 AM, Jared Angell wrote:
Forgive me if before I learn a language I want to test the waters
to make sure that it is speakable.
On 10/26/07, Penguino < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Seriously Jared, could you please lose some of that attitude? You
have barely learned the la
Forgive me if before I learn a language I want to test the waters to make
sure that it is speakable.
On 10/26/07, Penguino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Seriously Jared, could you please lose some of that attitude? You have
> barely learned the language, and yet you come in barging with all these
Jared Angell wrote:
Perhaps lojban is such a 'perfect' language in terms of how well thought
out and logical it is on so many levels that it is impossible to speak
it on a broad level with it's current rules.
Lojban is hardly a "perfect language". It was designed to be a
"different" language
Correction again: boldi'udru would get rid of the consonant triple; both
work, but I think I prefer this one.
Sorry for multiple posting; I'm used to making multiple corrections in my
posts, which is difficult to do in a mailing list.
On 10/27/07, Penguino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Which inc
Which incidentally is also approximately what the Chinese word for "roof" (屋顶)
breaks up to. ;)
Correction; drudi also means "lid"; so perhaps boldijdru "sphere building
lid (roof)" would be more appropriate.
Seriously Jared, could you please lose some of that attitude? You have
barely learned the language, and yet you come in barging with all these
opinions about it, lunging at those who are trying to help you just because
they couldn't come up with a word for "geodesic dome" within 24 hours. I bet
sim
Ok, I must have been misinformed or forgot...I read about the algorithm
before I really got into this.
But my point stands.
On 10/26/07, Pierre Abbat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Friday 26 October 2007 18:03, Jared Angell wrote:
> > Alternatively perhaps Lojban should not have been made in t
On Friday 26 October 2007 18:03, Jared Angell wrote:
> Alternatively perhaps Lojban should not have been made in this way.
> Perhaps using Esperanto, English, Latin, Japanese or perhaps a mixture of
> them all to get root (irrespective of how difficult it would have made some
> word formation to s
On Fri, Oct 26, 2007 at 05:16:43PM -0500, Jared Angell wrote:
> I just want to pre-empt the reply that I am expecting now. 'Geodesic dome'
> is not a concept of English which is ambigous and requires many different
> words in Lojban.
In fact, it is a very specific concept. And the more precisely
On 10/26/07, Jared Angell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Perhaps lojban is such a 'perfect' language in terms of how well thought out
> and logical it is on so many levels that it is impossible to speak it on a
> broad level with it's current rules.
>
> If a word such a geodesic dome requires this mu
I just want to pre-empt the reply that I am expecting now. 'Geodesic dome'
is not a concept of English which is ambigous and requires many different
words in Lojban.
This is so because: "A geodesic dome is an almost spherical structure based
on a network of struts arranged on great circles (geode
Perhaps lojban is such a 'perfect' language in terms of how well thought out
and logical it is on so many levels that it is impossible to speak it on a
broad level with it's current rules.
If a word such a geodesic dome requires this much debate then if the
language suddenly had 1,000,000 speakers
> > Yes, but don't we do this sort of thing all the time:
> >
> > "So here on our right is a nice geodesic dome. The dome is blah blah.
> > When someone goes in the dome blah blah."
>
> In Lojban, insofar as this is done, we tend to more explicitly use
> anaphora (the generalized set of usages that
Joel Shellman wrote:
That is one philosophy of lujvo-making, but it leads to very long lujvo,
possibly with lots of extraneous places if you follow jvojva rules.
Zipf's law implies that such is inappropriate for concepts that see a
lot of use.
Yes, but don't we do this sort of thing all the tim
>= Original Message From Robert LeChevalier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> =
>
>> I'm sorry, I'm new here, but tell me this... if someone knew all the
>> basic vocabulary and the rules for creating new words, would they have
>> a good chance of knowing what rekyboldi'u means without any context
>> wh
On 10/26/07, Joel Shellman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --if one did follow the lujvo-making rules/conventions,
> would the place structure be deterministic then?
Only in a few special cases. For example, you can be practically
certain of place structures such as:
nunbroda: x1 nu x2 broda x3 x4
On 10/26/07, Robert LeChevalier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Joel Shellman wrote:
> > eg. "a spherish stonish-substance building used for residence"--a good
> > chance it means monolithic dome home. (though if it's specifically
> > sphere-ish and not ellipsoid, that wouldn't necessarily be accurate
Joel Shellman wrote:
eg. "a spherish stonish-substance building used for residence"--a good
chance it means monolithic dome home. (though if it's specifically
sphere-ish and not ellipsoid, that wouldn't necessarily be accurate).
It seems to me that rekyboldi'u should mean exactly what it says--a
Joel,
Your comments were very elucidating.Thank you!!!
Djared (Farlus)
On 10/25/07, Joel Shellman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On 10/25/07, Robert LeChevalier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > What is the predicate place structure of rekyboldi'u?
> >
> > > put in rekyboldi'u and it gives: fra
On 10/25/07, Robert LeChevalier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> What is the predicate place structure of rekyboldi'u?
>
> > put in rekyboldi'u and it gives: frame-ish-sphere-ish-building(s)
>
> That is more or less an etymological definition. But what kind of
> building is it really? Nuclear contain
Joel Shellman wrote:
I would think one of the wonderful benefits of lojban is that you can
do this--create a word that is very precise in what you mean. Granted,
that would mean an enormous vocabulary, thus my question--can someone
decompose a word they've never seen before and most likely unders
A computer, or a competent lojban-speaker can look at the lujvo and get back
the tanru.
However, without having seen the lujvo before, you need to guess what the
meaning is, because all you know is the tanru, and tanru can have ambiguous
meanings.
What is a frame-ish sphere? Perhaps it's a wirefr
So 'rekyboldi'u' could be used to describe the class of all geosesic
domes...but now I have learned that the type of geodome i was referring to
is the specific type made of triangles (and what if I mean the type with
windows, does this then make the word used even more complex?)
Does anyone guess
Joel Shellman posted:
It seems that if a program could determine what it means than that
> answers my question, that decomposition is deterministic? If so,
> besides being way cool, that should resolve any concern about having
> too large a vocabulary--so long as you know the roots and the rules,
> > I would think one of the wonderful benefits of lojban is that you can
> > do this--create a word that is very precise in what you mean. Granted,
> > that would mean an enormous vocabulary, thus my question--can someone
> > decompose a word they've never seen before and most likely understand
>
Joel Shellman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:I would expect we would not have a 1-1
correspondence between words in
different langages.
Amen brother!
I think that many of the vocabulary debates here go nowhere because people are
expecting to be able to find one lojban word that captures all of the
Joel Shellman wrote:
Some thoughts on this topic (please forgive my newbiness as this is
the beginners list :)
Each of those definitions (at least the ones that are indeed quite
different) could/should have a different word in lojban. So, if your
intention is to state a structure made of triangl
Some thoughts on this topic (please forgive my newbiness as this is
the beginners list :)
Each of those definitions (at least the ones that are indeed quite
different) could/should have a different word in lojban. So, if your
intention is to state a structure made of triangles, use that type of
wo
Jared Angell wrote:
"Except that they're not. Specifically, not just any arrangement of
triangles would not necessarily be geodesic. The important thing
about the design is that the struts form lines that are straight in
relationship to the curved surface. "
I'm referring to Buckminister Fuel
How about simply rekyboldi'u?
As for biodiesel, I'd go with poetic mivlivla
--gejyspa
s.
- Original Message
From: Jared Angell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Sent: Thursday, 25 October, 2007 11:18:23 AM
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: geodesic dome
"Except that they're not. Specifically, not just any arrangement of
triangles w
ing natural languages. Its
> value lie, I think, in becoming an international second language. As such, I
> would
> see natural evolution of the language as a disadvantage.
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Robert LeChevalier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: l
lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Sent: Thursday, 25 October, 2007 7:47:44 AM
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: geodesic dome
Jared Angell wrote:
> "The v and s aren't allowed together; they're a voiced-unvoiced
> consonant pair. They must either be separated with a y, or a
> differe
On 10/24/07, Jared Angell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Geodesic domes are half-spheres composed out of triangles, does that
> help???
Except that they're not. Specifically, not just any arrangement of
triangles would not necessarily be geodesic. The important thing about the
design is that th
On 10/24/07, Penguino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Wouldn't {ruvsirselgunma} be acceptable as well, though?
>
>
> Not really. The v and s aren't allowed together; they're a voiced-unvoiced
> consonant pair. They must either be separated with a y, or a different
> rafsi be selected.
>
Of course.
Jared Angell wrote:
"The v and s aren't allowed together; they're a voiced-unvoiced
consonant pair. They must either be separated with a y, or a
different rafsi be selected."
If Lojban is being allowed to evolve like a natural language than who cares?
Someone who values the fact that Lojban i
On 10/24/07, Penguino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Besides, voiced-unvoiced pairs are hard to pronounce.
>
> On 10/25/07, Penguino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Hey I'm just informing. I'm not about to enter a hardliner/naturalist
> > debate.
> >
> > On 10/25/07, Jared Angell < [EMAIL PROTEC
Besides, voiced-unvoiced pairs are hard to pronounce.
On 10/25/07, Penguino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Hey I'm just informing. I'm not about to enter a hardliner/naturalist
> debate.
>
> On 10/25/07, Jared Angell < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > "The v and s aren't allowed together; they're
Hey I'm just informing. I'm not about to enter a hardliner/naturalist
debate.
On 10/25/07, Jared Angell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> "The v and s aren't allowed together; they're a voiced-unvoiced
> consonant pair. They must either be separated with a y, or a
> different rafsi be selected."
>
>
"The v and s aren't allowed together; they're a voiced-unvoiced
consonant pair. They must either be separated with a y, or a
different rafsi be selected."
If Lojban is being allowed to evolve like a natural language than who cares?
Everytime a new fraze enters into contemporary English it violat
Geodesic domes are half-spheres composed out of triangles, does that help???
On 10/24/07, Penguino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Wouldn't {ruvsirselgunma} be acceptable as well, though?
>
>
> Not really. The v and s aren't allowed together; they're a voiced-unvoiced
> consonant pair. They mus
>
> Wouldn't {ruvsirselgunma} be acceptable as well, though?
Not really. The v and s aren't allowed together; they're a voiced-unvoiced
consonant pair. They must either be separated with a y, or a different
rafsibe selected.
On 10/24/07, Pierre Abbat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Wednesday 24 October 2007 19:46, Judson Lester wrote:
> > So, {xabybolci ruvsirsergum} ?
>
> {ruvsirsergum} is not well-formed. The lujvo for that tanru is
> {krusirselgunma}.
You're right - I tend to overreach, I think. Wouldn't {ruvsi
On Wednesday 24 October 2007 19:46, Judson Lester wrote:
> As to geodesic dome:
>
> {ta cu xabybolci je gunma be lo so'i sirji be ma'i lo kruvi sefta ku} By
> which I intend: that is a half-sphere and composed of many line segments,
> which are straight with respect to a curved surface.
>
> It migh
As to geodesic dome:
{ta cu xabybolci je gunma be lo so'i sirji be ma'i lo kruvi sefta ku} By
which I intend: that is a half-sphere and composed of many line segments,
which are straight with respect to a curved surface.
It might be better to relax the precision a bit and go with something more
l
*mivyselkra = organic*
*livla = fuel*
*
*
*I guess {mivyselkra livla} could be a good tanru. Not sure about how to
make it diesel, but there's no bio-gasoline that I know of, so it's good.*
*
*
*OTOH {likrtcigaso} is gasoline, so maybe {likrtcidizelo} is diesel, so we
can make a tanru like {mi
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