Am 6 Jun 2005 um 23:33 hat G.R. Crona geschrieben:
Otherwise, I think it would be very interesting, to make an inventory of the
pieces in the collected lute canon there are for 5 course lute (and also 5
course vihuela for that matter - i.e Mudarra?), as they imply works that
are from the
G.R. Crona [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb:
of the times. The text dealt with the word fumé. I always believed fumé
came to Europe with the discovery of tobacco after Columbus 1492. So what
was this fumé?
fumus = smoke (of fire)
Best,
Mathias
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Dear Mathias,
I know that! The text in this vocal piece seemed to leave nothing to
doubt though, with lines like head in the clouds of smoke lost in
the smoke or similar things. Quite extraordinary...
B.R.
G.
On 6/8/05, Mathias Rösel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
G.R. Crona [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Rainer wrote:
from my database:
5609 57/2 The rich Jew copied from 1186, Brookes No. 939, keyboard
1186 100v/2 ye rich Jew. Brookes, No. 939, keyboard
Dd.5.21 12r ???, recorder
Dd.9.33 38r/2 de Jerr a mort, lute
Dd.3.18 48r The Jewes Dawnce. R Nicolson [index:] Jewes Dawnce., lute
Dd.9.33
Hi,
just goofing hindsightedly (469 yrs.), trying to see what Neusidler was
really saying. [My brackets]
Here follows the Jew's dance, and whoever wishes to play it, must tune the
Lute differently. Here is the tuning. First tune the 5th course and the
small strings which lie next to the 5th
Hi all,
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005, G.R. Crona wrote:
surrealistic. The music was definitely what you would today call
avantgardistic, although still (barely) inside the musical idiom or fold
of the times. The text dealt with the word fumé. I always believed fumé
came to Europe with the
VERITAS
-Original Message-
From: Arto Wikla [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 5:12 PM
To: G.R. Crona
Cc: lute
Subject: Re: Judentanz Neusidler etc.
Hi all,
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005, G.R. Crona wrote:
surrealistic. The music was definitely what you would today call
On Jun 6, 2005, at 2:59 AM, Denys Stephens wrote:
Dear Ed,
I'm afraid that transcription misses one of the points
of Neusidler's tablature (which Arthur referred to in his
mailing) - when notes higher than the fifth fret are indicated
the alphabet is started again with a line placed above
: Sunday, June 05, 2005 8:11 PM
Subject: Re: Judentanz Neusidler etc.
Yes,that's from Apel's book on notation, where the facsimile appears also. I
shudder to think how many grad students transcribed that piece.
Thousands.
Of course, it was Adolf Koczirz who first drew attention to the supposed
bi
- Original Message -
From: Arthur Ness [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; G.R. Crona [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 9:53 PM
Subject: Re: Judentanz Neusidler etc.
The quint should be tuned to + (et) which looks like the t
Hi,
Now, with a little help and reading through the facsimile, I believe
that this should be a more correct version. As said, tune the 5th and
4th courses to D and leave 3rd 2nd and 1st courses as they are. So
it's to be played on a five course lute... Hmmm... could be quite an
old piece then
Hallo Göran,
thank you for your helpful work! That was a quick one!
Best regards
Hermann
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Oops! Stupid me. I didn't see that everything repeats from the 6th
fret. I expected altered symbols for the higher notes. Shows you how
often I read German tab. blush It makes more sense in the higher
position.
On Jun 6, 2005, at 1:00 AM, Ed Durbrow wrote:
So are there 2 versions of the
indicating the high fret,and others do not.
Arthur.
- Original Message -
From: Denys Stephens [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: lute net lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, June 05, 2005 7:01 AM
Subject: Re: Judentanz Neusidler etc.
Dear All,
I am sure Arthur will remember this, but it may
indicating the high fret,and others do not.
Arthur.
- Original Message -
From: Denys Stephens [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: lute net lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, June 05, 2005 7:01 AM
Subject: Re: Judentanz Neusidler etc.
Dear All,
I am sure Arthur will remember this, but it may
Dear Stewart,
Stewart McCoy wrote:
Dear Arthur,
The Jew's Dance is in Dd.3.18, etc., i.e. the Cambridge Consort
manuscripts. It's really a Bergamasca, which is quite different from
Newsidler's piece, but there is no reason why they should be the
same. No doubt Jews were associated with
Dear all,
I have a rather urgent request as I was invited to play a short concert
at a symposion in Austria: Jews and Christians in the Medieval and
renaissance. I was especially asked to play the Judentanz by Neusidler.
I have also learned that there are some other Jew's dances by Heckel,
Göran, thank you for your help. In the meantime I also found a facsimile
of the original print in German tabulature. Together with your ft2 it
helps me to create a performing edition, which I will send you as soon
as it is ready.
Best regards Hermann
PS.: Are there any opinions about the
Hier volget der Juden Tantz, und wer ihn schlagen will, der muss die Lautten
anders ziehen. Nun volget der Zug/ zieh Erstlich den Mitlern Brumer und die
klein Saitten/ die Newen dem mitl Brumer stet/ der zieffer furn/gleich als da 4.
und den klein Brumer. Muss gleich lautten/wie der mitl Brumer
There is also an English consort version of the jew's dance.
Alain
G.R. Crona wrote:
Hier volget der Juden Tantz, und wer ihn schlagen will, der muss die Lautten
anders ziehen. Nun volget der Zug/ zieh Erstlich den Mitlern Brumer und die
klein Saitten/ die Newen dem mitl Brumer stet/ der
I have to admit that this is not easy to read - mostly because of the use of
the old german string names which I need to translate into modern use for
myself to make sense out of this. I'll try a translatiom later - first have
to sort it.
The end is easy:
The yews dance has to be played very
Neusidler etc.
There is also an English consort version of the jew's dance.
Alain
G.R. Crona wrote:
Hier volget der Juden Tantz, und wer ihn schlagen will, der muss die
Lautten
anders ziehen. Nun volget der Zug/ zieh Erstlich den Mitlern Brumer und
die
klein Saitten/ die Newen dem mitl Brumer stet
. Crona [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 2:54 PM
Subject: Re: Judentanz Neusidler etc.
Hier volget der Juden Tantz, und wer ihn schlagen will, der muss die
Lautten
anders ziehen. Nun volget der Zug/ zieh Erstlich den Mitlern
Here follows the yew's dance and who wants to play it has to tune the lute
differently. Here follows the tuning.
First tune the Mittleren Brummer (c - assuming G-Tuning) and the klein
Saitten (small string) which is next to the mittleren Brummer (I assume
the f is meant) equal to the 4 (german
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 2:54 PM
Subject: Re: Judentanz Neusidler etc.
Hier volget der Juden Tantz, und wer ihn schlagen will, der muss die
Lautten
anders ziehen. Nun volget der Zug/ zieh Erstlich den Mitlern
Not very clear to me which tuning is meant ...
the highest string (g) should be g#
the second course should be d
the third isn't clear (d?)
the 4th in C or d? (all courses should sound equal to d)
the 5th in D
Maybe someone else gets it sorted better than I do...
Thomas.
Meanwhile...on a
Obviously on my head, too ... confusing everything. Should go to bed
Best wishes
Thomas
Am Samstag, 4. Juni 2005 23:57 schrieben Sie:
Alten Deutsch ist uber mein kopf ganz gegangt
Ron (UK)
--
Thomas Schall
Niederhofheimer Weg 3
D-65843 Sulzbach
06196/74519
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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