http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/jun/21/gchq-cables-secret-world-communica
tions-nsa
I suppose they really are tapping all of the fiber.. Huh?
On 6/21/13 11:42 AM, "Phil Fagan" wrote:
>I guess the moral here isdon't do anything "wrong."
>
>:-D
>
>
>On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 12:31 PM, William
On Jun 21, 2013, at 8:31 PM, William Herrin wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Owen DeLong wrote:
>> On Jun 21, 2013, at 5:10 PM, Phil Fagan wrote:
>>> I would think this is only an issue if they throw out the Fourth in that
>>> when
>>> they use that data collected "inadvertantly" to
Hah!
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 1:10 PM, Warren Bailey <
wbai...@satelliteintelligencegroup.com> wrote:
> The United States Constitution*
>
> *See Terms and Conditions for details, not all citizens apply, void where
> prohibited, subject to change at any time.
>
> On 6/21/13 11:42 AM, "Phil Fagan"
The United States Constitution*
*See Terms and Conditions for details, not all citizens apply, void where
prohibited, subject to change at any time.
On 6/21/13 11:42 AM, "Phil Fagan" wrote:
>I guess the moral here isdon't do anything "wrong."
>
>:-D
>
>
>On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 12:31 PM, Wi
I guess the moral here isdon't do anything "wrong."
:-D
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 12:31 PM, William Herrin wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Owen DeLong wrote:
> > On Jun 21, 2013, at 5:10 PM, Phil Fagan wrote:
> >> I would think this is only an issue if they throw out the Fourth
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Owen DeLong wrote:
> On Jun 21, 2013, at 5:10 PM, Phil Fagan wrote:
>> I would think this is only an issue if they throw out the Fourth in that when
>> they use that data collected "inadvertantly" to build a case a against you
>> they use no other data collected
Good point; apparently the doctorine does protect against the case whereby
any collected data would have been found anway "with a court order."
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 9:19 AM, Owen DeLong wrote:
>
> On Jun 21, 2013, at 5:10 PM, Phil Fagan wrote:
>
> I would think this is only an issue if they
On Jun 21, 2013, at 5:10 PM, Phil Fagan wrote:
> I would think this is only an issue if they throw out the Fourth in that when
> they use that data collected "inadvertantly" to build a case a against you
> they use no other data collected under a proper warrant.
That statement ignores a longs
I would think this is only an issue if they throw out the Fourth in that
when they use that data collected "inadvertantly" to build a case a against
you they use no other data collected under a proper warrent.
If the purpose was to actually collect data on you, in the event you do
something , they
On 06/09/13 11:10 -0500, Dan White wrote:
Let me put my gold tipped tinfoil hat on in response to your statement.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/20/fisa-court-nsa-without-warrant
If accurate, this is extremely concerning:
Top secret documents submitted to the court that oversees
On Thu, 6 Jun 2013, Alex Rubenstein wrote:
I've always just assumed that if it's in electronic form, someone else is either
reading it now, has already read it, or will read it as soon as I walk away from
the screen.
So, you are comfortable just giving up your right to privacy? It's just the w
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 04:36:32PM -0700, Scott Weeks wrote:
> NSA claims know-how to ensure no illegal spying:
> http://thegardenisland.com/news/state-and-regional/nsa-claims-know-how-to-ensure-no-illegal-spying/article_ec623964-d23a-53c6-aeb0-14bf325a7f3c.html
>
> scott
"We're the government. T
Funny, sort of. The guy was residing in Hawaii. Apologies
for the long URLs...
Report: NSA contract worker is surveillance source:
http://thegardenisland.com/news/state-and-regional/report-nsa-contract-worker-is-surveillance-source/article_2a88ec60-f99c-54a7-8c13-13f6852ccca6.html
Hawaii rea
> How would you tap a few TBit/s so that you can filter it down to where you
can look it at layer 7 in ASICs, and filter out something to a more
manageable data rate?
Well "lawful-intercept" is on by default.
And you don't get to worry about the L7 and filtering/parsing -that's done
by the black b
>Happily, none of the companies listed are transport networks:
I believe it's logical that government turned to biggest US based ISPs with
request to help monitoring communication channels after 2001 events, as back in
those days facebook was not around and google was not as prevalent.
But to b
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 11:10:57AM +0300, Kauto Huopio wrote:
> I would add opportunistic STARTTLS to all SMTP processing devices.
What we actually need is working opportunistic encryption
in IPv6, something like
http://www.inrialpes.fr/planete/people/chneuman/OE.html
I would add opportunistic STARTTLS to all SMTP processing devices.
--Kauto
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 12:23 AM, William Herrin wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 6, 2013 at 9:28 PM, Leo Bicknell wrote:
> > While there's a whole political aspect of electing people who pass
> > better laws, NANOG is not a polit
On 6/10/13, Rob McEwen wrote:
> On 6/9/2013 2:26 PM, Rob McEwen wrote:
> I should mention... there also "exceptions to the exceptions". While it
> is totally legal and ethical for a boss to snoop on his employee's
> e-mails (in a business), I would think it would be very unethical and
The organiz
On 6/9/2013 2:26 PM, Rob McEwen wrote:
> There are notable exceptions... for example, an employer is really the
> owner of the mailbox, not their employee. Therefore, there is an
> argument that government employees don't have "privacy rights" from the
> government for their official work e-mail ac
Le 09/06/2013 20:26, Rob McEwen a écrit :
> Dan,
>
> I doubt anyone can answer your question easily because you seem to have
> contradictions in your scenario. At one point you say:
>
>> private company to collect information about terrorist entities, who
>> in turn privately contracts with the top
On Thu, Jun 6, 2013 at 9:28 PM, Leo Bicknell wrote:
> While there's a whole political aspect of electing people who pass
> better laws, NANOG is not a political action forum. However many
> of the people on NANOG are in positions to affect positive change
> at their respective employers.
>
> - Imp
On Fri, Jun 07, 2013 at 04:17:14PM -0700, Eric Brunner-Williams wrote:
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/07/obama-china-targets-cyber-overseas
>
> the headline may be misleading.
>
> Presidential Policy Directive 20 defines OCEO as "operations and
> related programs or activities ? condu
Dan,
I doubt anyone can answer your question easily because you seem to have
contradictions in your scenario. At one point you say:
> private company to collect information about terrorist entities, who
> in turn privately contracts with the top X telecom providers and Y
> social media companies
June, 2013 04:24
> To: ku po
> Cc: NANOG
> Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
>
> To be fair, the reporting (initially) claimed the providers were granting
> the USG "access directly to their servers." It's understandable and
> appro
On Jun 9, 2013, at 7:20 AM, "R. Benjamin Kessler"
wrote:
> I see that there is actually a beast that will do encryption of multiple 10G
> waves between Cisco ONS boxes -
>
> https://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/collateral/optical/ps5724/ps2006/at_a_glance_c45-728015.pdf
>
> How many people are
On 08/06/2013 8:05 AM, Matthew Petach wrote:
On Sat, Jun 8, 2013 at 4:12 AM, Jimmy Hess wrote:
On 6/7/13, Måns Nilsson wrote:
Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project Date: Fri, Jun
07,
2013 at 12:25:35AM -0500 Quoting jamie rishaw (j...@arpa.com):
Just wait until we
On 06/07/13 18:20 -0700, Owen DeLong wrote:
While the government has no responsibility to protect my data, they do
have a responsibility to respect my privacy. While you are correct in that
proper personal security procedures to protect my data from random
crackers would, in fact, also protect it
On Saturday, June 08, 2013 6:44 PM, Ryan Malayter [mailto:malay...@gmail.com]
wrote:
> Speaking from the content provider dide here, but we've always run IPsec on
> DCIs and even "private" T1s/DS3s back in the day.
> Doesn't everyone do the same these days? I find it hard to imagine passing
> a
Yet appears a certain lack of transparency, no?
mh
Message d'origine
De : "Jason L. Sparks"
Date :
A : ku po
Cc : NANOG
Objet : Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
To be fair, the reporting (initially) claimed the providers were granting t
To be fair, the reporting (initially) claimed the providers were granting the
USG "access directly to their servers." It's understandable and appropriate
that the providers pushed back against that apparently erroneous reporting.
Jason
On Jun 8, 2013, at 22:44, ku po wrote:
> What is the po
I don't need any wire tapping or decrypting.
Let's say I want to see all NANOG emails, I just need to call Larry Page's
CSO office and someone will send me a copy.
of course I can't give you any evidence, how could I?
Does it make sense?
On Sun, Jun 9, 2013 at 10:44 AM, ku po wrote:
> What is t
What is the point to argue whether they have the capacity to process all
the data?
They DON'T need to build expensive systems.
They just need to make sure when they ask your company for information,
these information are available for them and fast enough.
So the statement that saying "we don't giv
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
On 08/06/2013 16:31, William Herrin wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 1:25 AM, jamie rishaw wrote:
>> Just wait until we find out dark and lit private fiber is getting
>> vampired.
>
> Why wait?
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/20/politics/20submari
On Jun 7, 2013, at 12:25 AM, jamie rishaw wrote:
>
> Just wait until we find out dark and lit private fiber is getting vampired.
>
Speaking from the content provider dide here, but we've always run IPsec on
DCIs and even "private" T1s/DS3s back in the day.
Doesn't everyone do the same thes
On 06/08/2013 01:47 PM, Jay Ashworth wrote:
> - Original Message -
>> From: "Wayne E Bouchard"
>> Remember that part of the issue is the fact that, thanks to the
>> Patriot Act and FISA, not only can you be given a warrant that does
>> not proceed through normal channels, you are forbidden
- Original Message -
> From: "Wayne E Bouchard"
> Remember that part of the issue is the fact that, thanks to the
> Patriot Act and FISA, not only can you be given a warrant that does
> not proceed through normal channels, you are forbidden from even
> acknowledging its very existence or
- Original Message -
> From: "Matthew Petach"
> Would you really trust "crypto" applied by someone else on your
> behalf?
>
> "sure, your data's safe--I triple rot-13'd it myself!" ;P
Oh, do we need triple now?
I've been double-ROT13'ing my data for *years*.
Cheers,
-- jra
--
Jay R
just normal sound security practice when permitting third-party network
connections.
---
() ascii ribbon campaign against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org
> -Original Message-
> From: Matthew Petach [mailto:mpet...@netflight.com]
> Sent: Friday, 07 June, 2013 10:33
> C
Cc: nanog@nanog.org
Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
You can keep a hacker out, true, but you cannot keep the government
out. When the force of law can be used to compell you to act against
your wishes or your own best interests, all bets are of. Hackers sneak
in through the
You can keep a hacker out, true, but you cannot keep the government
out. When the force of law can be used to compell you to act against
your wishes or your own best interests, all bets are of. Hackers sneak
in through the back door. The govt just breaks the front door down and
demands entry and th
On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 2:05 PM, wrote:
> On Thu, 06 Jun 2013 22:57:07 -0700, Mark Seiden said:
>> and also, only $20m/year? in my experience, the govt cannot do anything
>> like this
>> addressing even a single provider for that little money.
>
> Convince me the *real* number doesn't have anoth
On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 1:25 AM, jamie rishaw wrote:
> Just wait until we find out dark and lit private fiber is getting vampired.
Why wait?
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/20/politics/20submarine.html?_r=0
-Bill
--
William D. Herrin her...@dirtside.com b...@herrin.us
3005
project
On 6/7/13, Måns Nilsson wrote:
> Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project Date: Fri, Jun 07,
> 2013 at 12:25:35AM -0500 Quoting jamie rishaw (j...@arpa.com):
>>
>> Just wait until we find out dark and lit private fiber is getting
>> vampired.
>&g
On 8 June 2013 12:12, Jimmy Hess wrote:
> On 6/7/13, Måns Nilsson wrote:
> > Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project Date: Fri, Jun
> 07,
> > 2013 at 12:25:35AM -0500 Quoting jamie rishaw (j...@arpa.com):
> >>
> >> Just wait until we fi
On Sat, Jun 8, 2013 at 4:12 AM, Jimmy Hess wrote:
> On 6/7/13, Måns Nilsson wrote:
> > Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project Date: Fri, Jun
> 07,
> > 2013 at 12:25:35AM -0500 Quoting jamie rishaw (j...@arpa.com):
> >>
> >> Just wait un
On 6/7/13, Måns Nilsson wrote:
> Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project Date: Fri, Jun 07,
> 2013 at 12:25:35AM -0500 Quoting jamie rishaw (j...@arpa.com):
>>
>> Just wait until we find out dark and lit private fiber is getting
>> vampired.
>>
&
I think we know now, that they will know we are organizing.
Sent from my Mobile Device.
Original message
From: Ishmael Rufus
Date: 06/07/2013 6:32 PM (GMT-08:00)
To: Owen DeLong
Cc: NANOG
Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
Yeah... so when are we
Yeah... so when are we rioting? Because they'll just continue to make laws
that circumvent the constitution.
On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 8:20 PM, Owen DeLong wrote:
> Dan,
>
> While the government has no responsibility to protect my data, they do
> have a responsibility to respect my privacy. While
Dan,
While the government has no responsibility to protect my data, they do have a
responsibility to respect my privacy. While you are correct in that proper
personal security procedures to protect my data from random crackers would, in
fact, also protect it from the government, that's a far cr
Server maintenance at 00 on my end.
, 2013 at 3:49 PM, Michael Hallgren
> > >> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Le 07/06/2013 19:10, Warren Bailey a écrit :
> > >>>> Five days ago anyone who would have talked about the government
> having
> > >>>> this capability would
; Le 07/06/2013 19:10, Warren Bailey a écrit :
> >>>> Five days ago anyone who would have talked about the government having
> >>>> this capability would have been issued another tin foil hat. We think
> we
> >>>> know the truth now, but why hasn'
Sorry for the top post
;m not
>>>> calling anyone a liar, but isn't not speaking the truth the same thing?
>>>
>>>
>>> ;-)
>>>
>>> mh
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my Mobile Device.
>>>>
>>>>
t; the truth now, but why hasn't echelon been brought up? I'm not calling
>>> anyone a liar, but isn't not speaking the truth the same thing?
>>
>>
>> ;-)
>>
>> mh
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my Mobile Device.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/07/obama-china-targets-cyber-overseas
the headline may be misleading.
Presidential Policy Directive 20 defines OCEO as "operations and
related programs or activities … conducted by or on behalf of the
United States Government, in or through cyberspace, tha
em/
>
>
>
> Sent from my Mobile Device.
>
>
> Original message
> From: "Jason L. Sparks"
> Date: 06/07/2013 1:31 PM (GMT-08:00)
> To: Warren Bailey
> Cc: Jay Ashworth ,NANOG
> Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
>
&
t; ;-)
>
> mh
>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my Mobile Device.
>>
>>
>> Original message
>> From: Matthew Petach
>> Date: 06/07/2013 9:34 AM (GMT-08:00)
>> To:
>> Cc: NANOG
>> Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
yone a
> liar, but isn't not speaking the truth the same thing?
;-)
mh
>
>
> Sent from my Mobile Device.
>
>
> Original message
> From: Matthew Petach
> Date: 06/07/2013 9:34 AM (GMT-08:00)
> To:
> Cc: NANOG
> Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI
Bailey
Cc: Jay Ashworth ,NANOG
Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
I assume the unclassified word "Prism" (which is found everywhere on IC resumes
and open job descriptions) refers to Palantir's Prism suite. Could be wrong,
but seems logical.
On Fri, Jun 7
Ringsmuth
Date: 06/07/2013 1:38 PM (GMT-08:00)
To: NANOG list
Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
On Jun 7, 2013, at 10:02 AM, Christopher Morrow wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 1:57 AM, Mark Seiden wrote:
>
>> and also, only $20m/year? in my experience,
I've been trying to find details to the contrary but as far as I see,
there's no indication that the constitutional (or otherwise) rights of
any US citizens (or anyone, anywhere, for that matter) are being
overtly (or otherwise) trampled which would seem to be the pertinent
objection.
The somewhat
On Jun 7, 2013, at 10:02 AM, Christopher Morrow wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 1:57 AM, Mark Seiden wrote:
>
>> and also, only $20m/year? in my experience, the govt cannot do anything
>> like this
>> addressing even a single provider for that little money.
>
> agreed, that 20m seems extrao
> From: Jay Ashworth
> Date: 06/07/2013 12:16 PM (GMT-08:00)
> To: NANOG
> Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
>
>
> - Original Message -
> > From: "Valdis Kletnieks"
>
> > On Thu, 06 Jun 2013 22:57:07 -0700, Mar
6/07/2013 12:16 PM (GMT-08:00)
To: NANOG
Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
- Original Message -
> From: "Valdis Kletnieks"
> On Thu, 06 Jun 2013 22:57:07 -0700, Mark Seiden said:
> > and also, only $20m/year? in my experience, the govt cannot
le Device.
Original message
From: Mark Seiden
Date: 06/07/2013 12:11 PM (GMT-08:00)
To: valdis.kletni...@vt.edu
Cc: goe...@anime.net,NANOG
Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
i have talked with a dozen people about this who ought to know if there were
so
- Original Message -
> From: "Valdis Kletnieks"
> On Thu, 06 Jun 2013 22:57:07 -0700, Mark Seiden said:
> > and also, only $20m/year? in my experience, the govt cannot do
> > anything like this addressing even a single provider for that little money.
>
> Convince me the *real* number doe
i have talked with a dozen people about this who ought to know if there were
something
more creepy than usual going on.
and nobody in engineering knows of anything. but hm, people in compliance said
"no comment".
that, and the $20M annual number, suggests that what they actually did was set
On Thu, 06 Jun 2013 22:57:07 -0700, Mark Seiden said:
> and also, only $20m/year? in my experience, the govt cannot do anything like
> this
> addressing even a single provider for that little money.
Convince me the *real* number doesn't have another zero.
Remember - the $20M number came from a
ng?
Sent from my Mobile Device.
Original message
From: Matthew Petach
Date: 06/07/2013 9:34 AM (GMT-08:00)
To:
Cc: NANOG
Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project
On Thu, Jun 6, 2013 at 5:04 PM, Matthew Petach wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 6, 2013
On 6/7/2013 11:58 AM, Jay Ashworth wrote:
> With all due respect, Dr Mathews, I *know* Valdis[1]' reputation; he's a
> regular participant here.
>
> Who are you again?
>
> Cheers,
> -- jra
> [1] Note proper spelling of his name[2].
> [2] Note that I spelled your name correctly as well.
I am
On Thu, Jun 6, 2013 at 5:04 PM, Matthew Petach wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 6, 2013 at 4:35 PM, Jay Ashworth wrote:
>
>> Has fingers directly in servers of top Internet content companies,
>> dates to 2007. Happily, none of the companies listed are transport
>> networks:
>>
>>
>> http://www.washingto
On 6/7/13 8:28 AM, <<"tei''>>> wrote:
> This is one of these "Save the forest by burning it" situations that
> don't have any logic.
>
> To save a forest firefighters often cut a few tree. Don't cut all the
> trees in a forest to save it from a fire.
Seasonal work, many solar obits past.
Well,
- Original Message -
> From: "Mark Seiden"
> but the ability to assemble intelligence out of taps on providers'
> internal connections
> would require reverse engineering the ever changing protocols of all
> of those providers.
> and at least at one of the providers named, where i worked
- Original Message -
> From: "Robert Mathews (OSIA)"
> Being an AGENT or AGENCY of Change is not an activity most are CAPABLE
> of effectively thinking about, let alone acting upon.
[ ... ]
> Laziness aside, permit me to humbly note that emphasis on COMPLIANCE
> (with sane or insane la
- Original Message -
> From: "Robert Mathews (OSIA)"
> On 6/6/2013 9:22 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote:
>
> > Pay attention. None of the ones *listed* are transport networks.
> > Doesn't mean they're not involved but unlisted (as of yet).
>
> *Vladis: * I thank you for waking me up
- Original Message -
> From: "Robert Mathews (OSIA)"
> On 6/6/2013 7:35 PM, Jay Ashworth wrote:
>
> > [ . ] Happily, none of the companies listed are transport
> > networks:
> >
> > [ ]
> >
> > Cheers,
> > -- jra
>
>
> Could you be certain that TWC, Comcast, Qwest/CenturyLink
On 6/7/2013 11:42 AM, Dan White wrote:
> I believe it's your responsibility to protect your own data, not the
> government's, and certainly not Facebook's.
Dan, I agree with everything you said in your last post. Except this
part misses the point. Yes, it may not be their job to protect the data,
On 06/07/13 11:11 -0400, Rob McEwen wrote:
On 6/7/2013 9:50 AM, Dan White wrote:
OpenPGP and other end-to-end protocols protect against all nefarious
actors, including state entities. I'll admit my first reaction yesterday
after hearing this news was - so what? Network security by its nature
pre
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On 07/06/2013 16:02, Christopher Morrow wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 1:57 AM, Mark Seiden
> wrote:
>
>> and also, only $20m/year? in my experience, the govt cannot do
>> anything like this addressing even a single provider for that
>> little mone
This is one of these "Save the forest by burning it" situations that
don't have any logic.
To save a forest firefighters often cut a few tree. Don't cut all the
trees in a forest to save it from a fire.
Exceptions must be made for police forces to violate rights (like
privacy). Exceptions can'
On 6/7/2013 9:50 AM, Dan White wrote:
> OpenPGP and other end-to-end protocols protect against all nefarious
> actors, including state entities. I'll admit my first reaction yesterday
> after hearing this news was - so what? Network security by its nature
> presumes that an insecure channel is goin
On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 1:57 AM, Mark Seiden wrote:
> and also, only $20m/year? in my experience, the govt cannot do anything like
> this
> addressing even a single provider for that little money.
agreed, that 20m seems extraordinarily low for such an effort... hell,
for 6 yrs time transport co
> > So, you are comfortable just giving up your right to privacy? It's just the
> > way
> it is?
>
> If you want to exercise your right to privacy, use end to end encryption and
> onion remixing networks to hamper traffic analysis.
Whoa.
These are two completely separate issues. I concur with
On 06/07/13 02:34 -0400, Rob McEwen wrote:
The "oh well, it happens, who cares, guess you need PGP" comments on
this thread are idiotic. Some of you would benefit from reading the text
of the 4th Amendment:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers,
and effects, agai
> Approaches like
> http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2006/04/70619
> obviously don't scale to small time operators. But if you can vaccuum up close
> to the core at full wire speed (and there is no reason to think you can't,
> since
> there are switches which deal with that) you don't
On Fri, Jun 07, 2013 at 12:25:35AM -0500, jamie rishaw wrote:
>
> Just wait until we find out dark and lit private fiber is getting vampired.
>
Approaches like http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2006/04/70619
obviously don't scale to small time operators. But if you can vaccuum up
clo
On Thu, Jun 06, 2013 at 08:07:57PM -0400, Alex Rubenstein wrote:
> > > Has fingers directly in servers of top Internet content companies,
> > > dates to 2007. Happily, none of the companies listed are transport
> > > networks:
> >
> > I've always just assumed that if it's in electronic form, some
Subject: Re: PRISM: NSA/FBI Internet data mining project Date: Fri, Jun 07,
2013 at 12:25:35AM -0500 Quoting jamie rishaw (j...@arpa.com):
>
> Just wait until we find out dark and lit private fiber is getting vampired.
>
I'm not even assuming it, I'm convinced. In Sweden,
The "oh well, it happens, who cares, guess you need PGP" comments on
this thread are idiotic. Some of you would benefit from reading the text
of the 4th Amendment:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers,
and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall
On Jun 6, 2013, at 10:25 PM, jamie rishaw wrote:
>
> Just wait until we find out dark and lit private fiber is getting vampired.
>
>
well, that's exactly and the only thing what would not surprise me, given the
eff suit
and mark klein's testimony about room 421a full of narus taps. mark k
Just wait until we find out dark and lit private fiber is getting vampired.
--
Jamie Rishaw // .com.arpa@j <- reverse it. ish.
arpa / arpa labs
On Jun 6, 2013, at 6:28 PM, Leo Bicknell wrote:
>
> On Jun 6, 2013, at 8:06 PM, jim deleskie wrote:
>
>> Knowing its going on, knowing nothing online is secret != OK with it, it
>> mealy understand the way things are.
>
> While there's a whole political aspect of electing people who pass bet
On Jun 6, 2013 9:30 PM, "Jeff Kell" wrote:
>
>
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On 6/6/2013 9:22 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote:
> > On Thu, 06 Jun 2013 21:12:35 -0400, "Robert Mathews (OSIA)" said:
> >> On 6/6/2013 7:35 PM, Jay Ashworth wrote:
> >>> [ . ] Happily, no
On 6/6/2013 9:28 PM, Leo Bicknell wrote:
> However many of the people on NANOG are in positions to affect positive
> change at their respective employers.
>
> - Implement HTTPS for all services.
> - Implement PGP for e-mail.
> - Implement S/MIME for e-mail.
> - Build cloud services that encrypt on
On 6/6/2013 9:22 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote:
> Pay attention. None of the ones *listed* are transport networks.
> Doesn't mean they're not involved but unlisted (as of yet).
*Vladis: * I thank you for waking me up in class! I am
impressed - your finely tuned language hair "has pick
On Jun 6, 2013, at 8:06 PM, jim deleskie wrote:
> Knowing its going on, knowing nothing online is secret != OK with it, it
> mealy understand the way things are.
While there's a whole political aspect of electing people who pass better laws,
NANOG is not a political action forum.
However many
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
On 6/6/2013 9:22 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote:
> On Thu, 06 Jun 2013 21:12:35 -0400, "Robert Mathews (OSIA)" said:
>> On 6/6/2013 7:35 PM, Jay Ashworth wrote:
>>> [ . ] Happily, none of the companies listed are transport
networks:
>
>> Cou
On Thu, 06 Jun 2013 21:12:35 -0400, "Robert Mathews (OSIA)" said:
> On 6/6/2013 7:35 PM, Jay Ashworth wrote:
> > [ . ] Happily, none of the companies listed are transport networks:
> Could you be certain that TWC, Comcast, Qwest/CenturyLink could not be
> involved?
Pay attention. None of t
On 6/6/2013 7:35 PM, Jay Ashworth wrote:
> [ . ] Happily, none of the companies listed are transport
> networks:
>
> [ ]
>
> Cheers,
> -- jra
Could you be certain that TWC, Comcast, Qwest/CenturyLink could not be
involved?
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