Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-27 Thread Luiz Felipe
LOL!!! I'll make my CD covers only from square-sensor cameras... ...personal taste... LF Godfrey DiGiorgi escreveu: I grew up with a Rolleiflex TLR. I love square photos, although for practical reasons most of my photos are rectangular. 2:3 format always seems too oblong for my taste, I find

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-27 Thread Luiz Felipe
rorestrial algorithm to correct the light fall-off in the corners. Maybe enough to push current 14mp to 16+ without breaking too many eggs. LF (ok, just another wild theory) William Robb escreveu: - Original Message - From: "JC OConnell" Subject: RE: Square sensor, was Re: Pen

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-27 Thread John Francis
It's fairly easy. Start with the regular tiling of the plane by hexagons. Now inscribe a circle in each hexagon (so you end up with rows of circles, with alternate rows staggered by half width). A little simple mathematics shows that the area of each circle is just over 90% of the area of the ci

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-27 Thread Thibouille
I highly doubt that but would like to be proven wrong, please do :) On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 11:39 PM, John Francis wrote: > > Not really.  While you can pack rectangular sensors at 100% efficiency, > you don't lose that much using circular sensors - the obvious layout > only wastes a little less

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread John Francis
Not really. While you can pack rectangular sensors at 100% efficiency, you don't lose that much using circular sensors - the obvious layout only wastes a little less than 10% of the total area. and that's if you assume infinite wafer sizes - for current wafer sizes losses at the edge are going t

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Thibouille
No, t would waste a lot more materials on a manufacturing point of view and as a consequence, pice would sky rocket. On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Joseph McAllister wrote: > Yes, it would make more sense and waste less raw materials if the sensor was > a 36mm circular one. No longer any worrie

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Mark Roberts
Joseph McAllister wrote: Yes, it would make more sense and waste less raw materials if the sensor was a 36mm circular one. No longer any worries about tilted horizons. Image formatting would be done entirely post, choosing whatever orientation you wanted. Never did understand why we have to use

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Joseph McAllister
Yes, it would make more sense and waste less raw materials if the sensor was a 36mm circular one. No longer any worries about tilted horizons. Image formatting would be done entirely post, choosing whatever orientation you wanted. Never did understand why we have to use round lenses to cre

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread paul stenquist
What a hoot!! And I still don't like square format:-)). Paul On Apr 26, 2009, at 1:45 PM, Adam Maas wrote: On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 1:39 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: On Apr 26, 2009, at 10:30 AM, Adam Maas wrote: And thanks for confirming the 'I heard it from a salesguy' provenance of your

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Tim Bray
On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 8:03 AM, Bong Manayon wrote: > Interestingly, 3 photos recently accepted in PPG in the past months > were square crop...I sort of feel that I am being 'conditioned' to > 'like' the square format... It's a slippery slope. I've started, as a matter of course in Lightroom,

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Adam Maas
On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 1:39 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: > > On Apr 26, 2009, at 10:30 AM, Adam Maas wrote: > >> And thanks for confirming the 'I heard it from a salesguy' provenance >> of your info. Retailers, unless you're talking about B&H or Robert >> White sized ones, are not 'Industry Source

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Godfrey DiGiorgi
On Apr 26, 2009, at 10:30 AM, Adam Maas wrote: And thanks for confirming the 'I heard it from a salesguy' provenance of your info. Retailers, unless you're talking about B&H or Robert White sized ones, are not 'Industry Sources', even if well-connected. I've heard far sillier things from the ow

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Adam Maas
On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 1:23 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: > > On Apr 26, 2009, at 10:13 AM, Adam Maas wrote: > >> The info you were getting sounds a lot more like 'I heard it from a >> salesguy' than an 'industry source', considering that it's about as >> accurate as most 'Pentax/Leica is dead' typ

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Godfrey DiGiorgi
On Apr 26, 2009, at 10:13 AM, Adam Maas wrote: The info you were getting sounds a lot more like 'I heard it from a salesguy' than an 'industry source', considering that it's about as accurate as most 'Pentax/Leica is dead' type rumours. My sources are the owners of a commercial photographic e

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Adam Maas
On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 1:02 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: > > On Apr 26, 2009, at 9:50 AM, Adam Maas wrote: > >> On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi >> wrote: >>> >>> On Apr 26, 2009, at 8:38 AM, Mark Roberts wrote: >>> Paul Stenquist wrote: > > Certainly not marketable

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Godfrey DiGiorgi
On Apr 26, 2009, at 9:50 AM, Adam Maas wrote: On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: On Apr 26, 2009, at 8:38 AM, Mark Roberts wrote: Paul Stenquist wrote: Certainly not marketable. Most photographers are conditioned to using the rectangle to shape their work. I sho

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Adam Maas
On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: > > On Apr 26, 2009, at 8:38 AM, Mark Roberts wrote: > >> Paul Stenquist wrote: >>> >>> Certainly not marketable. Most photographers are conditioned to using the >>> rectangle to shape their work. I shot 6x6 for many years. Never did like i

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread William Robb
- Original Message - From: "Godfrey DiGiorgi" Subject: Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7 > The company "Victor Hasselblad" doesn't exist anymore. Hasselblad today > is just a brand, the cameras are built by Fuji. The classic Hasselblad &g

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Godfrey DiGiorgi
On Apr 26, 2009, at 8:38 AM, Mark Roberts wrote: Paul Stenquist wrote: Certainly not marketable. Most photographers are conditioned to using the rectangle to shape their work. I shot 6x6 for many years. Never did like it, never will. Square is definitely a niche market. And yes, Hasselbl

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Adam Maas
On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 11:54 AM, Mark Roberts wrote: > William Robb wrote: >> >> - Original Message - From: "Mark Roberts" >> >>> Hasn't even Hasselblad dropped square format? >> >> No. > > I meant with regard to digital. In film there's little cost increase > associated with square forma

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Mark Roberts
William Robb wrote: - Original Message - From: "Mark Roberts" Hasn't even Hasselblad dropped square format? No. I meant with regard to digital. In film there's little cost increase associated with square format (because the camera maker doesn't have to provide the "sensor") so it

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Adam Maas
On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 11:38 AM, Mark Roberts wrote: > Paul Stenquist wrote: >> >> Certainly not marketable. Most photographers are conditioned to using the >> rectangle to shape their work. I shot 6x6 for many years. Never did like it, >> never will. Square is definitely a niche market. And  yes

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread William Robb
- Original Message - From: "Mark Roberts" Subject: Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7 > > Hasn't even Hasselblad dropped square format? > No. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to U

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread William Robb
- Original Message - From: "JC OConnell" Subject: RE: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7 > SQUARE has two huge advantages: > > 1. No need to rotate camera for portrait orientation if using a cropped > retanglular subset of the square > > 2. More efficient us

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Mark Roberts
Paul Stenquist wrote: Certainly not marketable. Most photographers are conditioned to using the rectangle to shape their work. I shot 6x6 for many years. Never did like it, never will. Square is definitely a niche market. And yes, Hasselblad and other MF makers have been successful in that nic

RE: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread JC OConnell
.net] On Behalf Of Paul Stenquist Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 11:09 AM To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List Subject: Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7 Certainly not marketable. Most photographers are conditioned to using the rectangle to shape their work. I shot 6x6 for many years. Never did like

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Godfrey DiGiorgi
I grew up with a Rolleiflex TLR. I love square photos, although for practical reasons most of my photos are rectangular. 2:3 format always seems too oblong for my taste, I find 3:4 and slightly squarer proportions more appealing. It's definitely one of the reasons I like FourThirds format.

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Paul Stenquist
Certainly not marketable. Most photographers are conditioned to using the rectangle to shape their work. I shot 6x6 for many years. Never did like it, never will. Square is definitely a niche market. And yes, Hasselblad and other MF makers have been successful in that niche, but it's still

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Bong Manayon
On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 10:16 PM, Mark Roberts wrote: > > Yes, it would need a different mirror/viewfinder assembly. It would increase > sensor cost significantly, for sensor area that wouldn't even be used most > of the time (except when shooting in square format -- a rarity for most of > us). A

Re: Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Mark Roberts
Sandy Harris wrote: Mark Roberts wrote: Dario Bonazza wrote: I've never considered the square sensor as a credible option. The "square sensor" idea was ridiculous fantasy from the very beginning. It makes sense in terms of getting the most out of your lenses. For any given criterion of wha

Square sensor, was Re: Pentax K7

2009-04-26 Thread Sandy Harris
Mark Roberts wrote: > Dario Bonazza wrote: >> >> I've never considered the square sensor as a credible option. > > The "square sensor" idea was ridiculous fantasy from the very beginning. It makes sense in terms of getting the most out of your lenses. For any given criterion of what acceptable p