At 01:30 PM 08/03/2002 -0700, you wrote:
>I thought it happens when your wife is a socialist and you actually pay some
>attention to what she says.
Hmmm. Reminds me of when I used to be married to a Trotskyist. Since he was
so busy doing political work and thinking political thoughts, he never h
I thought it happens when your wife is a socialist and you actually pay some
attention to what she says.
Cheers, Ken Hanly
- Original Message -
From: "Ben Day" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2002 2:30 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:28907]
>I thought you were a bourgeois liberal. I'm confused. How do you
>reconcile a collectivist philosophy with a radically individualist
>one?
>Doug
dialectic?
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In a message dated 7/30/02 1:47:06 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Justin Schwartz wrote:
>I am in fact a socialist.
I thought you were a bourgeois liberal. I'm confused. How do you
reconcile a collectivist philosophy with a radically individualist
one?
Doug
I am a
Title: RE: [PEN-L:28913] Expertise and Vanguard Parties
moi:>there are two main types of liberalism:
>
>(1) Manchester, classical, or "neo" liberalism, which embraces
>_laissez-faire_; and
>
>(2) New Deal, Keynesian, or modern liberalism, which embraces t
>
>Justin Schwartz wrote:
>
>>What part do you reject, Doug? Representative govt? Univeral
>>suffrage? Extensive civil and political liberties? In fact you
>>reject none of it. You are a bourg lib too, as are probably 95% of
>>the people on this list.
>
>I reject none of it except your label.
See
>
>there are two main types of liberalism:
>
>(1) Manchester, classical, or "neo" liberalism, which embraces
>_laissez-faire_; and
>
>(2) New Deal, Keynesian, or modern liberalism, which embraces the state as
>the solution to capitalism's various problems. (Most social democracy fits
>here, BTW.)
At 08:55 PM 07/30/2002 +, you wrote:
>What part do you reject, Doug? Representative govt? Univeral suffrage?
>Extensive civil and political liberties? In fact you reject none of it.
>You are a bourg lib too, as are probably 95% of the people on this list.
Explain the bourgeois part.
Thanks
Justin doesn't pollute my mind at all, in fact he has enlightening things
to say from which I, being ignorant about the USA, benefit. Every vanguard
party should have at least one Justin in it. Justin is in the vanguard
-regardless of whether you agree with him -, because he has been through
a
The father of "bourgeois" liberalism (I put "bourgeois" in quotes here,
since if we mean industrial bourgeoisie, this would be inaccurate) - John
Stuart Mill - was also a socialist. And in fact, a market socialist, like
Justin Schwartz. When you extend liberalism to the workplace, things like
Name calling and the like from both of you serves no purpose.
On Tue, Jul 30, 2002 at 08:38:05PM +, Justin Schwartz wrote:
> >
> >Well, I'm glad we can agree on one thing--you are indeed a bourgeois
> >liberal.
> >Why you hang out on pen-l is still a mystery to me, however. I think very
> >
In a message dated 7/30/02 1:38:53 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> >
> >Well, I'm glad we can agree on one thing--you are indeed a bourgeois
> >liberal.
> >Why you hang out on pen-l is still a mystery to me, however. I think very
> >few
> >people here regard themselv
Title: RE: [PEN-L:28899] Re: Re: Re: Expertise and Vanguard Parties
Doug writes: >And what about that word "liberal"? It carries with it the now
largely forgotten modifier "Manchester," no? An atomized competitive
system with no real room for notions of social solid
Justin Schwartz wrote:
>What part do you reject, Doug? Representative govt? Univeral
>suffrage? Extensive civil and political liberties? In fact you
>reject none of it. You are a bourg lib too, as are probably 95% of
>the people on this list.
I reject none of it except your label. It's too go
>Justin Schwartz wrote:
>
>>I am in fact a socialist.
>
>I thought you were a bourgeois liberal. I'm confused. How do you reconcile
>a collectivist philosophy with a radically individualist one?
>
>Doug
As I have explained, liberal democracy (the politics we bourg libs support)
involves repre
Justin Schwartz wrote:
>I am in fact a socialist.
I thought you were a bourgeois liberal. I'm confused. How do you
reconcile a collectivist philosophy with a radically individualist
one?
Doug
>
>Well, I'm glad we can agree on one thing--you are indeed a bourgeois
>liberal.
>Why you hang out on pen-l is still a mystery to me, however. I think very
>few
>people here regard themselves as "bourgeois liberals". What is your
>program--to "wise up" the left??
Oddly enough, I am on the left
[I wrote:]
> >It is a popular bourgeois myth that there is no place for expertise in
> >politics. Actually, there is room for knowledge, wisdom, a scientific
> >approach, and expertise everywhere, and certainly in politics.
[In a message dated 7/29/02 9:17:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL
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