Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-24 Thread john cummings
Absolutely, I don't want to push anything under the rug. I'll put a section in there for issues and what the Wikidata community is planning to do about them. On 24 September 2017 at 01:00, James Heald wrote: > Equally, the page may usefully serve to inform contributors to

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-23 Thread James Heald
Equally, the page may usefully serve to inform contributors to Wikidata about legitimate concerns from other projects that have arisen out of test integrations, that there is a need to do more to address. -- James. On 23/09/2017 22:18, john cummings wrote: Hi all I'm putting aside time

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-23 Thread john cummings
Hi all I'm putting aside time next week to write up an information page on Wikidata for contributors to other Wikimedia projects who want to know more about/may have concerns about reusing Wikidata on other projects. I hope this will help people having the same discussions over and over and allay

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-23 Thread James Heald
It's not just other wikis where cryptic template invocations can be an issue. I sometimes think that on Wikidata itself, with templates {{P|...}} and {{Q|...}}, we could use a bot to add the label of the property or item in the default language of the page as an extra parameter to the

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-22 Thread LeadSongDog
My point, Andy, was that some parameters can be required, such as CS1 requiring the parameter Title. Further, the Ref parameter can be automated, as with ref=harv. > On Sep 22, 2017, at 5:09 PM, Andy Mabbett wrote: > >> On 22 September 2017 at 01:45, LeadSongDog

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-22 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 22 September 2017 at 01:45, LeadSongDog wrote: > Not "enforcing", but it's certainly possible to show an error message for > missing parameters. Many other cite templates do so. The subject under discussion was "a legible refname"; that's not a parameter of the

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread LeadSongDog
Not "enforcing", but it's certainly possible to show an error message for missing parameters. Many other cite templates do so. Sent from my iPad > On Sep 21, 2017, at 4:20 PM, Andy Mabbett wrote: > >> On 21 September 2017 at 20:09, LeadSongDog

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 21 September 2017 at 20:09, LeadSongDog wrote: > When working on a wp article with, in some cases, several hundred > references, one needs mnemonic tools to keep from confusing them. Requiring > a legible refname or Harvard ref would go far to addressing this The

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread LeadSongDog
It is unsurprising that editors find such references unreadable, they are. When working on a wp article with, in some cases, several hundred references, one needs mnemonic tools to keep from confusing them. Requiring a legible refname or Harvard ref would go far to addressing this, though it

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread David Cuenca Tudela
On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 1:22 AM, Dario Taraborelli < dtarabore...@wikimedia.org> wrote: > I don't know exactly how this should be designed (some user research seems > in order before coming up with any solution). The problem to me is how to > design subscription/synchronization mechanisms giving

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread john cummings
OK, I was unsure how much overlap in general information there would be between different implementations on different projects but I guess its quite a lot :) 2017-09-21 10:37 GMT+02:00 Lydia Pintscher : > On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 10:31 AM, john cummings >

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread Lydia Pintscher
On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 10:31 AM, john cummings wrote: > Lydia, so something called something like > https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Help:FAQ/Wikipedia_infoboxes ? How about "Wikidata in Wikimedia projects" or similar? Because we're seeing similar questions in other

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread john cummings
Lydia, so something called something like https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/ Help:FAQ/Wikipedia_infoboxes ? Thanks John On 21 September 2017 at 10:09, Jane Darnell wrote: > Well I firmly believe most of the friction is just basic "not invented > here" sentiments, which we have

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread Jane Darnell
Well I firmly believe most of the friction is just basic "not invented here" sentiments, which we have seen since Commons was started. Maybe there is some central page there that we can follow which is dealing with the same basic issues? As I recall one of the biggest problems in the beginning was

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread Lydia Pintscher
On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 8:46 AM, john cummings wrote: > Lydia, I would be happy to help work on your suggestion, which page do you > think this info should be added to? Should it be a new page or info added to > an existing one? <3 Maybe as a subpage of

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-21 Thread john cummings
Lydia, I would be happy to help work on your suggestion, which page do you think this info should be added to? Should it be a new page or info added to an existing one? Thanks On 21 September 2017 at 01:22, Dario Taraborelli wrote: > Jane – I think you hit it on

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-20 Thread Dario Taraborelli
Jane – I think you hit it on the nail. I don't know exactly how this should be designed (some user research seems in order before coming up with any solution). The problem to me is how to design subscription/synchronization mechanisms giving people freedom to choose which data to reuse or not and

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-20 Thread Lydia Pintscher
On Wed, Sep 20, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Thomas Douillard wrote: > If my experience in correct, this would not stop anything. There are usually > very basic arguments about data duplication and data reuse, ease of > maintenance and so on, stuffs that should be on an

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-20 Thread Thomas Douillard
If my experience in correct, this would not stop anything. There are usually very basic arguments about data duplication and data reuse, ease of maintenance and so on, stuffs that should be on an introduction about Wikidata and Wikipedia. But this won’t be enough and some people will push stuff

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-20 Thread Lydia Pintscher
On Wed, Sep 20, 2017 at 1:03 PM, Thomas Douillard wrote: > I don’t know what you disagree with but personally I investd a lot of time > in those discussions in frwiki, and I keep a lot of bitterness over the > process. This seems like a wierdly very very similar redux

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-20 Thread Thomas Douillard
I don’t know what you disagree with but personally I investd a lot of time in those discussions in frwiki, and I keep a lot of bitterness over the process. This seems like a wierdly very very similar redux of those discussions with the exact same arguments, and I’m done with all this. I’m also

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-20 Thread Yaroslav Blanter
No, I actually disagree. There is a number of English Wikipedia users who advocate banning Wikidata completely (I mean, not banning it as a project, but banning any direct interaction with Wikidata). Some of them are reasonable, some of them are not reasonable. Some of their arguments have merit,

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-20 Thread Yaroslav Blanter
There is also a more general and very useful discussion of the same issues at this page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Wikidata/2017_State_of_affairs (check recent edits, last 5 days or so). Since it is not related to any decision-making (at least not yet) I would expect it is

Re: [Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-20 Thread Yaroslav Blanter
Thanks Dario. May I please add that whereas the deletion discussion is of course open to everyone, a sudden influx of users who are not regular editors of the English Wikipedia will be looked at extremely negatively. Please be considerate. Cheers Yaroslav On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 8:18 PM, Dario

[Wikidata] Deletion nomination of Template:Cite Q on English Wikipedia

2017-09-19 Thread Dario Taraborelli
Hey folks, I wanted to draw your attention to a deletion nomination discussion for an experimental template – {{Cite Q}} – pulling bibliographic data from Wikidata: