Hi, > 1) What does "as of 1.9.2" mean exactly? Is this a change of behaviour > from older versions?
By the time of the writing (which included SMW 1.9.2 therefore "as of" and all previous versions) SMW does not support a "real" auto update mechanism for queries and with "real" auto update we think of "smart queries" where an algorithm is used to find a data diff which would trigger a refresh of only those related subjects and its queries within the store (and hopefully invalidates the MediaWiki html/parser cache we well otherwise it prevents the page from displaying the update results). [0] refers to the query update not the property/value update of a page. > 2) Does a page edit/save where a property value is changed trigger an > update/refresh or not? It does not directly trigger an UpdateJob but of course it triggers an synchronizes update of the Store. Two exceptions are made for the change of a property type (those on a `Property:` page) and when creating a redirect (as explained in [1]). [0] http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Automatic_query_update [1] http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:UpdateJob Cheers On 9/25/14, Neill Mitchell <ne...@nlkmitchell.com> wrote: > Hi. > > Following [0] led me to this: > http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Automatic_query_update which states: > > Currently Semantic MediaWiki (as of 1.9.2) does not support a "real" > auto update (aka "smart" queries) that would refresh the results of > pages that include the query results. > > I want to achieve clarity on this (and it is the entire point of my > github ticket). So, my questions are: > > 1) What does "as of 1.9.2" mean exactly? Is this a change of behaviour > from older versions? > 2) Does a page edit/save where a property value is changed trigger an > update/refresh or not? > > Clarification of these will probably answer Bernhard's query as well. > > Many thanks. > > > On 25/09/14 13:56, James HK wrote: >> Hi, >> >> A short summary of the current discussion. I further recommend to read >> [0] which tries to explain as to when the `UpdateJob` is triggered. >> >> Krabina Bernhard: >> >> Using SMW 1.8.0.5 / MW 1.22 with "Suddenly, without anybody knowing >> why, ~ 5000 have been done, but > 7000 are still sitting there ", "our >> problem is not only that we cannot get the hanging jobs to run, but >> that even new jobs being created (by changing a template or CSV import >> with data transfer) will not run.... " >> >> Yaron Koren >> >> Explains that "each job is only attempted a certain number of times >> before MediaWiki basically just gives up and ignores it" and by >> executing "UPDATE job SET job_attempts = 0" allows to reset the >> "job_attempts" field. >> >> James Montalvo / Daren Welsh >> >> Upgrading to MW 1.23 and SMW 2.0 from 1.22/1.8.0.5 seeing "stuck" jobs >> for "job_cmd of refreshLinks in job ... other four have job_cmd of >> SMW\UpdateJob", "Those "stuck" jobs just keep repeating over and >> over.", "runJobs evidently will eventually stop (or time-out) but only >> after repeating certain jobs hundreds of times." >> >> Phil Legault >> >> Explained that "same issue a while ago after I restored a database." >> but "ran another backup from my production database after I cleared >> the runjobs, and this worked out fine after". >> >> Neill Mitchell >> >> I can't think of any reason why the current thread and [1] are related >> based on the information given in [0]. >> >> [0] http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:UpdateJob >> [1] >> https://github.com/SemanticMediaWiki/SemanticMediaWiki/issues/518#issuecomment-54269008 >> >> Related discussions >> >> - https://github.com/SemanticMediaWiki/SemanticMediaWiki/issues/212 >> - https://github.com/SemanticMediaWiki/SemanticMediaWiki/pull/307 >> - https://github.com/SemanticMediaWiki/SemanticMediaWiki/issues/330 >> - https://github.com/SemanticMediaWiki/SemanticMediaWiki/issues/297 >> - >> http://wikimedia.7.x6.nabble.com/Re-Job-queue-affecting-semantic-queries-in-MW-1-22-tp5029433.html >> - http://wikimedia.7.x6.nabble.com/SMW-UpdateJob-error-tp5036300.html >> >> Cheers >> >> On 9/25/14, Neill Mitchell <ne...@nlkmitchell.com> wrote: >>> Hi Bernhard. >>> >>> Perhaps you are seeing the same issue as me. I have this logged on >>> github: >>> https://github.com/SemanticMediaWiki/SemanticMediaWiki/issues/518#issuecomment-54269008 >>> >>> Please let me know if you think your issue may be the same as mine. >>> >>> Best regards >>> Neill. >>> >>> On 25/09/14 12:02, Krabina Bernhard wrote: >>>> our problem is not only that we cannot get the hanging jobs to run, but >>>> that even new jobs being created (by changing a template or CSV import >>>> with data transfer) will not run.... >>>> >>>> regards, >>>> Bernhard >>>> >>>> ----- Ursprüngliche Mail ----- >>>>> I had the same issue a while ago after I restored a database. >>>>> I figured it was because when I ran the backup there where jobs in the >>>>> queue >>>>> and after the restore they kept running over and over and etc. >>>>> >>>>> I ran another backup from my production database after I cleared the >>>>> runjobs, >>>>> and this worked out fine after. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: James Montalvo [mailto:jamesmontal...@gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 5:55 PM >>>>> To: Daren Welsh >>>>> Cc: Semantic MediaWiki developers; Yaron Koren; Semantic MediaWiki >>>>> users >>>>> Subject: Re: [Semediawiki-user] [SMW-devel] MediaWiki Job queue problem >>>>> >>>>> Daren and I work together, so we have the same issue. One thing to add: >>>>> Run >>>>> jobs never finishes. Those "stuck" jobs just keep repeating over and >>>>> over. >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Sep 24, 2014 at 4:51 PM, Daren Welsh <darenwe...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I have executed runJobs several times and the job_attempts remains at >>>>>> 1 for those five jobs. We were thinking of doing a database backup >>>>>> today, then delete those five jobs from the table, then run the SMW >>>>>> "repair and upgrade" via the admin special page. >>>>>> >>>>>> Even if this clears the job queue, we'd like to understand what caused >>>>>> this in the first place. I realize that's a very open-ended question >>>>>> :) >>>>>> >>>>>> Daren >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Sep 24, 2014 at 4:30 PM, James HK >>>>>> <jamesin.hongkon...@gmail.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We currently have five jobs that are "stuck". All of them have 1 >>>>>>>> for job_attempts. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> One has job_cmd of refreshLinks in job namespace 10 and it is for a >>>>>>>> template page. >>>>>>>> The other four have job_cmd of SMW\UpdateJob in job namespace 0 and >>>>>>>> are >>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> "standard" pages. These pages do not seem to be related based on >>>>>>> category >>>>>>>> or template. >>>>>>> Just to make sure that I interpret the meaning of "stuck" correctly, >>>>>>> after finishing `runJobs` those four jobs (five with the >>>>>>> `refreshLinks` jobs) are still visible in the job table with an >>>>>>> "job_attempts" of 1. When running `runJobs` again the same four >>>>>>> `SMW\UpdateJob` (same as in the same title and same Id) jobs are >>>>>>> executed and increment the "job_attempts" to 2? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If you empty the job table and execute `runJobs` does the same five >>>>>>> jobs appear again after the run with "job_attempts" = 1? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 9/25/14, Daren Welsh <darenwe...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> We currently have five jobs that are "stuck". All of them have 1 >>>>>>>> for job_attempts. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> One has job_cmd of refreshLinks in job namespace 10 and it is for a >>>>>>>> template page. >>>>>>>> The other four have job_cmd of SMW\UpdateJob in job namespace 0 and >>>>>>>> are >>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> "standard" pages. These pages do not seem to be related based on >>>>>>> category >>>>>>>> or template. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wed, Sep 24, 2014 at 3:37 PM, James HK >>>>>>>> <jamesin.hongkon...@gmail.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> runJobs.php will literally run forever. After the non-offending >>>>>>>>>> jobs are cleared it's easy to see which are the offenders. Thus >>>>>>>>>> far I think >>>>>>> all >>>>>>>>>> offenders have been of type SMW::UpdateJob. >>>>>>>>> I don't think the problem is with the `SMW\UpdateJob` because it >>>>>>>>> does a simple "shallow update" of the store while the management >>>>>>>>> of job status (including how many attempts, id's etc.) are done by >>>>>>>>> the MW JobQueue (which has first change in 1.22 and then again in >>>>>>>>> 1.23). >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> It does beg the question whether all `SMW\UpdateJob`'s are "stuck" >>>>>>>>> or only certain jobs belonging to a group of pages or single page? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> runJobs.php, but for some reason they keep attempting to run >>>>>>>>>> over and >>>>>>>>> over. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> How do you know that the same job is run over and over again >>>>>>>>> because based and above discussion ("job_attempts") a job with too >>>>>>>>> many attempts is retired after some time. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> If the same job is run over and over again, what is displayed for >>>>>>>>> the "job_attempts" counter? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> [0] went into SMW 2.0 to counteract any possible job duplicates >>>>>>>>> for the same `root title`. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> [0] >>>>>>>>> https://github.com/SemanticMediaWiki/SemanticMediaWiki/pull/307 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Cheers >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 9/25/14, James Montalvo <jamesmontal...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure if this is related, but on my wiki I'm occasionally >>>>>>>>>> getting "stuck" jobs. I've only noticed this since upgrading to >>>>>>>>>> MW 1.23 and >>>>>>> SMW >>>>>>>>> 2.0 >>>>>>>>>> from 1.22/1.8.0.5. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> What I mean by "stuck" is that the jobs don't get executed when >>>>>>>>>> I do runJobs.php, but for some reason they keep attempting to >>>>>>>>>> run over and >>>>>>>>> over. >>>>>>>>>> runJobs.php will literally run forever. After the non-offending >>>>>>>>>> jobs are cleared it's easy to see which are the offenders. Thus >>>>>>>>>> far I think >>>>>>> all >>>>>>>>>> offenders have been of type SMW::UpdateJob. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Is there some way to debug runJobs.php so I can provide better >>>>>>>>>> info? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> --James >>>>>>>>>> On Sep 24, 2014 10:55 AM, "Yaron Koren" <ya...@wikiworks.com> >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I certainly hope so too - or that there's some other standard >>>>>>>>>>> way to get previously-attempted jobs to be run again. I only >>>>>>>>>>> know that I tried that SQL trick once, and it worked. Perhaps >>>>>>>>>>> this is another reason why >>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> question should have instead been sent to the mediawiki-l >>>>>>>>>>> mailing list. >>>>>>>>>>> :) >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Sep 24, 2014 at 11:35 AM, James HK < >>>>>>>>> jamesin.hongkon...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> column is greater than 0 for all the rows in the table; I >>>>>>>>>>>>> think >>>>>>> if >>>>>>>>>>>>> you >>>>>>>>>>>> just >>>>>>>>>>>>> go into the database and call something like "UPDATE job >>>>>>>>>>>>> SET >>>>>>>>>>>> job_attempts = >>>>>>>>>>>>> 0", they will get run again. >>>>>>>>>>>> In case this solves the issue, I sincerely hope there is a >>>>>>> different >>>>>>>>>>>> way (a more standard way) to reset the "job_attempts" field >>>>>>>>>>>> other than by using a SQL statement to manipulate the job >>>>>>>>>>>> table. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 9/25/14, Yaron Koren <ya...@wikiworks.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I believe the issue is the "job_attempts" field in the "job" >>>>>>>>>>>>> table. >>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>>>>> believe each job is only attempted a certain number of >>>>>>>>>>>>> times before MediaWiki basically just gives up and ignores >>>>>>>>>>>>> it. My guess is >>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>>>>> column is greater than 0 for all the rows in the table; I >>>>>>>>>>>>> think >>>>>>> if >>>>>>>>>>>>> you >>>>>>>>>>>> just >>>>>>>>>>>>> go into the database and call something like "UPDATE job >>>>>>>>>>>>> SET >>>>>>>>>>>> job_attempts = >>>>>>>>>>>>> 0", they will get run again. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -Yaron >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> WikiWorks · MediaWiki Consulting · http://wikiworks.com >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> --------- >>>>>>>>>>> Meet PCI DSS 3.0 Compliance Requirements with EventLog Analyzer >>>>>>>>>>> Achieve PCI DSS 3.0 Compliant Status with Out-of-the-box PCI >>>>>>>>>>> DSS Reports Are you Audit-Ready for PCI DSS 3.0 Compliance? >>>>>>>>>>> Download White paper Comply to PCI DSS 3.0 Requirement 10 and >>>>>>>>>>> 11.5 with EventLog Analyzer >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=154622311&iu=/4140/ostg >>>>>>> .clktrk >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> Semediawiki-user mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> semediawiki-u...@lists.sourceforge.net >>>>>>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/semediawiki-user >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> --------- >>>>>>>>> Meet PCI DSS 3.0 Compliance Requirements with EventLog Analyzer >>>>>>>>> Achieve PCI DSS 3.0 Compliant Status with Out-of-the-box PCI DSS >>>>>>> Reports >>>>>>>>> Are you Audit-Ready for PCI DSS 3.0 Compliance? Download White >>>>>>>>> paper Comply to PCI DSS 3.0 Requirement 10 and 11.5 with EventLog >>>>>>>>> Analyzer >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=154622311&iu=/4140/ostg >>>>>>> .clktrk >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Semediawiki-devel mailing list >>>>>>>>> Semediawiki-devel@lists.sourceforge.net >>>>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/semediawiki-devel >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> __________________ >>>>>>>> http://mixcloud.com/darenwelsh >>>>>>>> http://www.beatportfolio.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> __________________ >>>>>> http://mixcloud.com/darenwelsh >>>>>> http://www.beatportfolio.com >>>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> Meet PCI DSS 3.0 Compliance Requirements with EventLog Analyzer Achieve >>>>> PCI >>>>> DSS 3.0 Compliant Status with Out-of-the-box PCI DSS Reports Are you >>>>> Audit-Ready for PCI DSS 3.0 Compliance? 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