Let me try explain in more detail...
As with most other Policy aspects, SLA has external, internal and configuration
aspects to it.
Take SLA as a specific example:
Policy: SLA
* External Aspects: Providers guarantee/attempted guarantee/objective
with percentages. These are what Anne refers to as the aspects driving service
selection.
* Internal Aspects: Typically might be something like internal
prioritization of customer varieties - typically this could be a relative
weight for GOLD, SILVER and BRONZE customers.
* Configuration: How exactly are you going to enforce, monitor, alert and
rectify of breach. This might be, for SLA ranging from pure passive monitoring
to active priority queues or load balancing configurations skewed towards
higher performance installations.
WS-Policy/Policy Attachment and its Assertions do a great job in "composing"
Assertions especially ones that are external. Others such as synapse rules XML
will be used for "composing" aspects that are internal.
One important aspect here - for true SOA Governance across the Lifecycle - is
the requirement for a metadata model for Policy that is readily transformed
into WS-Policy and Synapse.xml (in this example).
Make sense?
Mukund Balasubramanian
-----Original Message-----
From: Anne Thomas Manes [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sat 11/26/2005 11:30 PM
To: [email protected]
Cc:
Subject: Re: [service-orientated-architecture] Re: SOA Governance work
An SLA policy assertion language should allow you to specify service
level objectives in a standard way such that a monitoring agent can determine
whether or not the SLA is at risk of being broken and can then take appropriate
remedial action to make sure it doesn't.
It also allows you to select a service based on its promised service
level objectives.
Anne
On 11/23/05, Gautham Kasinath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Anne,
What do you reckon will be the components or features of a SLA
Policy
Assertion Language.
Well, can you elaborate on how SLA fits into Policy Assertion?
Thanks a bunch.
Cheers
G.
--- In [email protected], Anne
Thomas
Manes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> WS-Policy is just a bucket for expressing policies, which are
specified
> using domain-specific policy assertion languages. One of the
biggest
> challenges in from of us is defining reasonable policy
assertion
languages,
> eg. "SLA Policy Assertion Language".
>
> Anne
>
> On 11/22/05, Steve Ross-Talbot <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Do we have any notion of process/methodology for this?
> >
> > What is the relationship between such a process and
Business Process
> > Methodologies? My initial thoughts are that governance (at
least
as far
> > as active management to some notion of an SLA) is highly
related to
> > Business Process Management. This is because a Business
Process
> > described formally (in WS-CDL, BPEL or BPML or some such)
provides a
> > framework for policy attachments. This way we can make
policy
> > statements from a high level and iteratively down the
software stack
> > down to a granular service level.
> >
> > What sort of language do we need to express policy? Is it a
language in
> > which we make statements of fact and assert the facts over
the
> > services?
> > Is it a language in which we can make policy assertions
over existing
> > policies (perhaps specialising policies)? Is it a language
that
has any
> > notion of generalised computation (something that might be
needed for
> > SLA management)?
> >
> > We need to be very careful as to what sort of language we
need because
> > it has an impact on what sort of environment is needed to
enact such
> > policy statements.
> >
> > Is WS-Policy enough? Do we need something a little better
thought out
> > (perhaps something akin to PolicyRuleML?
> >
> > The language that we end up with needs to reflect what we
need to
> > describe a wide variety of policies and needs to dove tail
into
> > supporting a sensible methodology.
> >
> > I'd be interested in any thoughts on methodology and
language design
> > for describing policy.
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Steve T
> >
> > On 22 Nov 2005, at 00:45, Anne Thomas Manes wrote:
> >
> > > Spot on!
> > >
> > > Governance is about process. If you aren't willing to
rigorously
> > > execute the process, you won't have governance.
Governance tools
just
> > > help you execute the process. They can automate parts of
the
process,
> > > and they can erect hurdles that make it really
challenging to avoid
> > > the process. And in that way, they are very useful. But
if you don't
> > > have strong support from above that makes it clear that
the process
> > > must be executed, kiss the whole thing goodbye.
> > >
> > > Anne
> > >
> > > On 11/21/05, Sarode, Prashant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:So
> > > what I am getting confirmed here is that traditional
rules and
> > > mechanics of conventional IT Architecture and Governance
have
not yet
> > > changed. The recipe for success is same and so are
pitfalls for
> > > failure.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> For success you still need an Enterprise IT Architecture
&
Governance
> > >> body:
> > >> • That has a strong management muscle (or at least as
strong as
> > >> business muscle).
> > >> • That has strategic technology vision and appetite
can map to
> > >> business goals.
> > >> • That has strong technology people who equally
understand
business
> > >> and can make use of tools (like those mentioned by Anne)
to
automate
> > >> SOA governance process. Most importantly, people who can
win the
> > >> faith of Business that SOA can deliver $ benefits to
them.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> So basics are same …So to make a general
statementâ€"Those
organization
> > >> which have been mildy successful with IT
Architecture-Governance will
> > >> somewhat easily adapt to SOA governance model..
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Prashant Sarode
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> From: [email protected]
> > >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of
> > >> Biske, Todd
> > >> Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 11:57 AM
> > >> To: [email protected]
> > >> Subject: RE: [service-orientated-architecture] Re: SOA
Governance work
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Governance is one of my favorite topics. If someone
asked me the
> > >> thing that will influence the success of an SOA
initiative the
most,
> > >> it would be governance.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> As someone trying to build out an SOA in a corporate IT
environment,
> > >> I agree with Anne's definition 100%. A very easy way to
look at it
> > >> is to compare it to a traditional government. A
government has to
> > >> legislate, provide infrastructure, maintain strategic
plans,
enforce
> > >> laws (police force), etc. These are all activities that
an IT
> > >> organization must do to govern an SOA. In reality, these
are all
> > >> things that an IT organization should have been doing,
regardless of
> > >> whether SOA is being done or not.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> The same challenges that municipalities face in their
strategic
> > >> growth are faced by IT organizations. Urban centers grew
through a
> > >> very centralized approach, but have had to become more
and more
> > >> decentralized due to suburban sprawl. As rural
communities have
> > >> grown, they have had to work more and more with their
neighboring
> > >> communities, possibly sharing common infrastructure and
services.
> > >> The same is true of IT organizations. The urban center
can be
thought
> > >> of as the mainframe or legacy systems. Due to the web,
web
services,
> > >> etc., portions of the legacy logic needs to be
decentralized to
meet
> > >> the demands of the future. At the same time, silo'd
application
> > >> development represents the rural communities. These
applications
> > >> have grown, and the world of business processes is
requiring
them to
> > >> work together seamlessly, rather than through
inefficient handoffs
> > >> and redundant processing.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> When the first tool came out claiming to provide "SOA
Governance," I
> > >> almost laughed out loud, knowing that there is no tool
or
technology
> > >> that will provide SOA Governance. There are tools and
technologies
> > >> that can make governance easier, but ultimately, it will
come
down to
> > >> process and communication. If the process and
communication isn't
> > >> there, the governance won't be either. At the same time,
wecan't
> > >> governby processalone. The thingsbeing enforced (i.e. the
> > >> legislation) must be documented for all to see.Herein
lies the real
> > >> challege with regards to SOA or, more broadly,
applyinggovernance to
> > >> IT.SOA is about looking horizontallywhile others are
looking
> > >> vertically.Howdo you document therulesassociated
withmaking
> > >> something an enterprise service versus an
application-specific
> > >> service?Yes,we can have rules aroundWS-I compliance and
> > >> namingconventions,but this often comes down to semantics
and
> > >> astrategic vision (i.e.business serviceblueprint). This
isakin
> > >> to a business applying for a business license in acity.
There will
> > >> be guidelines for the application that must be followed,
butthere
> > >> isstill a judgement that must be doneby a city council
as to
> > >> whether they want the business in their city. There may
be general
> > >> guidelines in the city master plan, and the opinions of
the council
> > >> members are exposed through the political process, but
largely,
> > >> things will be handled on a case by case basis by a set
of people
> > >> given the responsibility for making those decisions. If
you
have the
> > >> wrong people in place, you won't be successful.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> -tb
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> -----Original Message-----
> > >> From: Anne Thomas Manes [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >> Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 7:17 AM
> > >> To: [email protected]
> > >> Subject: Re: [service-orientated-architecture] Re: SOA
Governance work
> > >>>
> > >>> I'd love to see further discussion on this topic. I'd
love to hear
> > >>> from people what governance practices they are putting
into place.
> > >>>
> > >>> Steve -- you seem to be associating governance with
autonomic
> > >>> computing, so I feel obliged to reiterate that
governance is not
> > >>> limited in scope to runtime efforts. Governance applies
to all
> > >>> stages of service lifecycle -- design, development,
testing, QA,
> > >>> release engineering, staging, provisioning, operations,
client
> > >>> provisioning, testing, error tracking, revisions, etc.
> > >>>
> > >>> Certainly you want to make runtime operations run as
smoothly as
> > >>> possible and resolve hiccups as autonomically as
possible, but I
> > >>> would call that SOA management rather than SOA
governance. Back to
> > >>> Gautham's comment -- WSM products play an enforcement
role in
> > >>> governance, because they typically enforce a bunch of
policies at
> > >>> service provisioning time (configuring security for the
service,
> > >>> etc), and they enforce policies at runtime (authN,
authZ,
auditing,
> > >>> etc). But SOA governance requires a lot more than just
policy
> > >>> enforcers. Enforcement is the easy part.
> > >>>
> > >>> Governance is actually more about putting hurdles in
place to
> > >>> verify compliance than it is about making things go
smoothly.
> > >>> Governance makes sure that developers don't circumvent
the ops
> > >>> people so that they can get their app out more quickly.
Governance
> > >>> is about making sure that apps have been thoroughly
tested before
> > >>> they get deployed. Governance is about making sure that
an app has
> > >>> the proper security protections in place. Governance is
about
making
> > >>> sure that the next consumer that gets permission to use
a service
> > >>> doesn't overwhelm the system and bring down 20 other
apps.
> > >>>
> > >>> Some parts of governance can be automated. Other parts
of
> > >>> governance can be guided using human workflow. Other
parts of
> > >>> governance are definitely manual in nature. For
example, no one's
> > >>> going to generate your corporate SOA policies for you.
That
takes a
> > >>> lot of hard work and collaboration across departments
and business
> > >>> units. Defining the policies is the hard part.
> > >>>
> > >>> The governance tools I mentioned from Systinet and
WebLayers are
> > >>> policy management systems. They help with the policy
definition
> > >>> process by providing a database to capture and maintain
the
> > >>> policies, and they help with policy compliance testing.
Policies are
> > >>> reusable artifacts that have their own lifecycle. They
are
defined,
> > >>> codified, used, and revised. A policy management system
provides the
> > >>> means to:
> > >>> • codify and document a policy (e.g., all services
must use
> > >>> literal encoding and here's how you test for
compliance),
> > >>> • group policies (e.g., the WS-I BP policy group
comprises a
> > >>> couple hundred individual policies),
> > >>> • attach policies/policy groups to various service
> > >>> groups/services/service artifacts
> > >>> • identify when artifacts should be tested for
compliance (code
> > >>> check-in, build, registration, invocation, etc)
> > >>> • test services/service artifacts for compliance
> > >>> • report on compliance violations
> > >>> • provide an approval process for compliance waivers
> > >>>
> > >>> Anne
> > >>>
> > >>> On 11/19/05, Steve Ross-Talbot <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> I agree that the workshop was not entitled governance
for SOA
at all.
> > >>> But it was very much in that direction. As you say
governance is a
> > >>> very
> > >>> wide topic. Alas your reports are not available whereas
the
position
> > >>> papers at the workshop are freely available. So at
least it is a
> > >>> start
> > >>> and coupled with your basic thoughts perhaps we can
drive
forward in
> > >>> the right direction.
> > >>>
> > >>> I'd be interested in any open discussion on the topic
as I have
> > >>> spend a
> > >>> good deal of time talking to people about this in
various roles
> > >>> (vendors, users and just practitioners) and thus far it
remains
> > >>> something of a wish list rather than something that
really
exists in
> > >>> product. I do know that the companies you mentioned
have made
> > >>> strides
> > >>> in this area (including Systinet - your old company,
and of course
> > >>> Enigmatec - my old company) but we are a long way off
from
achieving
> > >>> the sort of governance that is needed to achieve the
IBM vision of
> > >>> autonomic computing.
> > >>>
> > >>> So any ideas thoughts would be welcome and doubly so if
we can
make
> > >>> it
> > >>> an open discussion.
> > >>>
> > >>> Cheers
> > >>>
> > >>> Steve T
> > >>>
> > >>> On 19 Nov 2005, at 13:52, Anne Thomas Manes wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> >Based on my experience working with clients, I
disagree that the
> > >>> term
> > >>> > "governance" is scoped to the subject of the W3C
workshop on
> > >>> > constraints and capabilities. I've written a lot about
governance
> > >>> for
> > >>> > Burton Group. Unfortunately, I can't share those
reports
with you
> > >>> > because Burton Group reports are available only to
subscribers.
> > >>> >
> > >>> >But I will share with you some basic thoughts:
> > >>> >
> > >>> > Governance refers to the processes that an enterprise
puts in
> > >>> place to
> > >>> > ensure that things are done right, where "right"
means in
> > >>> accordance
> > >>> > with best practices, architectural principles,
government
> > >>> regulations,
> > >>> > laws, and other determining factors. SOA governance
refers
to the
> > >>> > processes used to govern adoption and implementation
of SOA.
> > >>> >
> > >>> >SOA governance involves three steps:
> > >>> > 1 Define SOA policies
> > >>> > 2 Deploy an SOA infrastructure that supports adoption
> > >>> of these
> > >>> > policies
> > >>> > 3Institute a set of formal processes and procedures
> > >>> that verify
> > >>> > compliance with these policies
> > >>> >
> > >>> > SOA policies relate to issues such as:
> > >>> > • · Design principles
> > >>> > • · Preferred design patterns
> > >>> > • · Application-factoring rules
> > >>> > • · Naming conventions
> > >>> > • · Metadata requirements
> > >>> > • · Documentation
> > >>> > • · Preferred products
> > >>> > • · Product selection guidelines
> > >>> > • · Preferred domain standards
> > >>> > • · Preferred industry standards
> > >>> > • · Methods for dealing with regulatory
requirements
> > >>> > • · Methods for assessing security risks
> > >>> > • Methods for implementing security based on risk
> > >>> factor
> > >>> > • · Methods for ensuring reliability and
transaction
> > >>> > integrity·
> > >>> > • Service testing
> > >>> > • New service deployment and staging
> > >>> > • · Service registration
> > >>> > • · Service classification
> > >>> > • · Service provisioning
> > >>> > • · Service configuration
> > >>> > • · Service monitoring
> > >>> > • · Client provisioning
> > >>> > • · Service modification
> > >>> > • · Service versioning
> > >>> > • · Impact analysis
> > >>> > • · Service level objectives (SLO)
> > >>> > • · Service level agreement (SLA) compliance
tracking
> > >>> > • · Error tracking and resolution
> > >>> >This list is long, but it barely scratches the surface.
> > >>> >
> > >>> >Products that help with SOA governance include
registries,
> > >>> > repositories, software asset management systems,
workflow,
testing
> > >>> > tools, web services management.
> > >>> >
> > >>> >No one vendor covers the full SOA governance lifecycle.
> > >>> >
> > >>> >Leading players in the SOA governance software market
include:
> > >>> > • Systinet and WebLayers, who provide policy
> > >>> management systems
> > >>> > (repository-based system for managing the lifecycle
of codified
> > >>> > policies) as well as policy compliance testing tools
and
> > >>> integrated
> > >>> > workflow for managing approval processes. Mindreef
also does
some
> > >>> > compliance testing, but at a much smaller scope.
> > >>> > • Systinet, Infravio, Flashline, and LogicLibrary,
> > >>> who provide
> > >>> > registries, repositories, and/or software asset
management
> > >>> systems,
> > >>> > which are extremely useful for managing SOA assets
and which can
> > >>> be
> > >>> > used as a gatekeeper for institution of governance
approval
> > >>> processes
> > >>> > at various points in the service lifecycle (dev,
testing,
staging,
> > >>> > provisioning, revisions)
> > >>> > • AmberPoint, Actional, Layer 7, and Reactivity,
who
> > >>> provide support
> > >>> > for governance at the service provisioning and
runtime stages.
> > >>> >Anne
> > >>> >
> > >>> > On 11/19/05, Gautham Kasinath < [EMAIL PROTECTED] >
wrote:
> > >>> >>
> > >>> >> Thanks for the brief explanation. I am reading the
workshop
> > >>> materials
> > >>> >> from W3C on the topic, following your advice.
> > >>> >>
> > >>> >> Thanks again.
> > >>> >>
> > >>> >> Cheers
> > >>> >> Gautham Kasinath
> > >>> >> --- In
[email protected], Steve
> > >>> >> Ross-Talbot <[EMAIL PROTECTED] ...> wrote:
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > Gautham,
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > Normally the term governance as applied to SOA is
based
on the
> > >>> >> notion
> > >>> >> > of static governance.
> > >>> >> > This is the sort of thing that WS-Policy (which is
not a
> > >>> standard)
> > >>> >> is
> > >>> >> > all about. A recent workshop
> > >>> >> > run by W3C looked at wider notions of governance
including the
> > >>> more
> > >>> >> > interesting form which is
> > >>> >> > dynamic governance.
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > It probably makes sense to take a peek at the W3C
workshop
> > >>> papers to
> > >>> >> > get a better understanding
> > >>> >> > of what governance is all about.
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > Cheers
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >>> Steve T
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > W3C Workshop on Constraints and Capabilities for
Web Services
> > >>> >> > http://www.w3.org/2004/09/ws-cc-program.html#papers
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > On 19 Nov 2005, at 00:33, Gautham Kasinath wrote:
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > > Hello,
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >What exactly is SOA governance? Is it goverining
an SOA
> > >>> >> framework,
> > >>> >> > >like in monitoring request-response, SLA etc?
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >Cheers
> > >>> >> > >Gautham Kasinath
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >--- In
[email protected], John
> > >>> >> Crupi
> > >>> >> > ><[EMAIL PROTECTED] ...> wrote:
> > >>> >> > >>
> > >>> >> > >> Would you like to start with the
use-cases/scenarios first
> > >>> to
> > >>> >> helpÂ
> > >>> >> > >> narrow the problem?
> > >>> >> > >>
> > >>> >> > >> jc
> > >>> >> > >> -----------------------------------------
> > >>> >> > >> John Crupi
> > >>> >> > >> CTO, Enterprise Web Services Practice
> > >>> >> > >> Sun Distinguished Engineer
> > >>> >> > >> AIM: JohnCrupi
> > >>> >> > >> Blog: blogs.sun.com/crupi <
http://blogs.sun.com/crupi <http://blogs.sun.com/crupi> >
> > >>> >> > >> Cell: 301.526.7890
> > >>> >> > >>
> > >>> >> > >>
> > >>> >> > >> On Nov 18, 2005, at 12:22 AM, Tilak Mitra
wrote:
> > >>> >> > >>
> > >>> >> > >> > I am looking for some real world
implementation of SOA
> > >>> >> > >> > Governance, starting right from a project
inception
> > >>> >> > >> > i.e. Strategy and Visioning , through Design,
> > >>> >> > >> > Implementation and right through operational
and
> > >>> >> > >> > runtime.
> > >>> >> > >> > Any white paper / research work or material
in any
> > >>> >> > >> > other form would be helpful.
> > >>> >> > >> > Thanks
> > >>> >> > >> > Regards
> > >>> >> > >> > Tilak
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> > __________________________________
> > >>> >> > >> > Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel
sites in one
> > >>> click.
> > >>> >> > >> > http://farechase.yahoo.com
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> >ÂVisit your group
"service-orientated-architecture"
on the
> > >>> >> web.
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> >ÂTo unsubscribe from this group, send an
email to:
> > >>> >> > >>
> > >>> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> >ÂYour use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
Yahoo!
Terms
> > >>> of
> > >>> >> > > Service.
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >> >
> > >>> >> > >>
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > > SPONSORED LINKS
> > >>> >> > > Service-oriented architecture
> > >>> >> > > Computer monitoring software
> > >>> >> > > Computer and internet software
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> > >>> >> > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
> > >>> >> > >
> > >>> >> > > ââ€"ª  Visit your group
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> > >>> >> on the web.
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> > >>> >> > > ââ€"ª  To unsubscribe from this group, send
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> > >>> >>Yahoo! Groups Links
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> > >>> > Service-oriented architecture
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