I hope this isn't trolling, as I find it a very informative discussion. But I wonder, if this hair pulling has an opposite to it? Has he not experienced anything that he liked?
Andy On Mon 14. May 2018 at 11:32, Alastair Hearsum <alast...@glassworks.co.uk> wrote: > Is this trolling? I'm not sure. But I feel I have to keep shooting this > kind of thing down. Without naming names you know the guy that created a > very complex feather system in ICE here at Glasswork, on the job. We have > been using Houdini as you know for a few years now, so with the combination > of a technically minded artist who operates at a high level exposed to > Houdini for few years who is still tearing his hair out in frustration > points to the issues with Houdini. > They need to seriously look at improving their user interaction. Its not > just about getting used to it. > > > On 12/05/2018 16:18, Jordi Bares wrote: > > I would suggest to give it a proper go, if you have used ICE you will see > how easy it is. > > jb > > > > On 12 May 2018, at 10:48, Tom Kleinenberg <zagan...@gmail.com> wrote: > > This is a really interesting discussion and covers thoughts from all > angles. There is an element to the discussion of technical types telling > the rest of us we just need to "git gud" which is a bit disheartening > though. (It's disheartening not because it's patronising but because the > only way to use Houdini is to master it at fairly high technical level > which will exclude a number of people, myself included). I understand that > there is a technical learning curve to any piece of software but Houdini is > a different beast to the other big three (Max, Maya, eXSI). You can drop a > Maya artist in XSI and tell them to achieve a task and they'll do it - > maybe not the most efficient way, but a way that works. I don't feel that's > the same in Houdini. There's too much "well, nobody really models in > Houdini" or "you can, but nobody really animates in Houdini". That's not > necessarily bad, Zbrush is probably the "best" software on the market in > terms of expectations to results but it's clear about it's narrow focus. > > To put it in a personal way, I've worked to some level in 3DS Max, Maya, > Lightwave and XSI. I wouldn't consider myself particularly artistically > gifted or technically proficient but I am good at understanding the needs > of a non-technical person (eg art-director), drawing up a list of > requirements and achieving them, getting support from concept artists are > pipeline TD's if needed. XSI was* the software that allowed me to go the > furthest independently (*was because I've had to move to Maya). I would > love to replace that and Houdini appears to be a good fit but I'm not sure. > Maybe the "uber-nodes" you're discussing are anathematic to Houdini's > overall workflow but would be streamline the on-boarding process. XSI was > excellent at getting people into the software and then allowing you to get > into the more complex bits on your own; although ICE was the main weapon in > my arsenal, it's possible to work for years without ever touching it. > > On 12 May 2018 at 09:34, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> @Matt, Exactly my thoughts (but clearly better explained) >> >> I would certainly advocate to improve things in terms of node >> functionality or assisting better in certain aspects (blend shape manager, >> exporting bundles in and out, or adding hierarchical overrides in takes, or >> adding certain tools we use every single day, or bringing more “uber nodes” >> to VOPs so we don’t have to be so granular) but always without sacrificing >> proceduralism or breaking their core design. >> >> Jb >> >> >> >> On 11 May 2018, at 22:04, Matt Lind <speye...@hotmail.com> wrote: >> >> Given Houdini is a node based system, there is a simple paradox at play >> that in order to get the level of cohesiveness Softimage employed, tools >> need to share information and work together. A node based system, by >> design, requires each node to act independently. To get the Softimage >> workflow in Houdini requires either monolithic nodes with enough >> intelligence to cover all the bases of a particular task, or the UI needs >> to take control and hide the nodes behind the scenes slapping user's wrists >> if they attempt to fiddle with the nodes involved. In either case, it works >> against a node based system's mantra. >> >> In short, I don't think it's possible for Houdini to ever become another >> Softimage. You'll have to settle for something that has great power but >> some degree of cumbersome workflow. >> >> Matt >> >> Message: 2 Date: Fri, 11 May 2018 18:44:10 +0100 From: Alastair Hearsum < >> alast...@glassworks.co.uk> Subject: Re: Houdini : non VFX jobs? To: >> softimage@listproc.autodesk.com >> >> I think there is real danger in pinning all this grumbling on lack of >> familiarity and not acknowledging that there are some fundamental design >> issues . The first step to recovery is to admit that there a problem. As >> everyone knows there is some fantastic technology in there but its strung >> together in an awful way. Its like putting the organs of a 20 year old in >> an octagenarian; each organ very capable in its own right but not in the >> ideal host to get the best out if it. >> >> ------ Softimage Mailing List. To unsubscribe, send a mail to >> softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with “unsubscribe” in the >> subject, and reply to confirm. >> >> >> >> ------ >> Softimage Mailing List. >> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with >> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm. >> > > ------ > Softimage Mailing List. > To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with > "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm. > > > > > ------ > Softimage Mailing List. > To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with > "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm. > > > -- > Alastair Hearsum > Creative Director of 3d > [image: GLASSWORKS] > > 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> [image: > Vimeo] > 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[image: > Instagram] > 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> [image: > Twitter] > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__u7507473.ct.sendgrid.net_wf_click-3Fupn-3D5SmYwFIJXHmC5X9wAP0G6mg4oLGBuQENbeDkYXezg3m6vjHxJcC6rUMd8QE2Mtqz4eMFTv0EHUJxLnXkpQi7s8c4jNSplqncANo7mVILEBEX-2D2BQKTRuQQsXoH7r-2D2BHXgxXSP2VvdVm0YPaoUhTwY0B6Ech0W0cwvQF6cSUXjMDhj1sNDd-2D2Bwruxw9xoAfABUkkrghj6EZUTeNXht5j444tYGOni2r2Pw4-2D2F00vvFsmWSA7kvrOyGe-2D2FzyaOE1RBPI565vbBUM20R962LNSeOOQmM64T1SPnR-2D2B-2D2Fx3aGwVEtAworFHLYGqowsw5rTgEWR9EpR6rg9Gw67S6QonDzUt9OKGeGgcmv4weqAJwYaDN5wtUEvqHJNrIzFnbn5HzOrLlz-2D2Fvn-5FTu5-2D2BJTCp1P-2D2FbeHmYVbiMY-2D2Fu-2D2FFvGEdLx5Z1LcfzH7zq-2D2BPUBYya2x4weu8aeHJmRKnQx0akDIxU-2D2FyburP949QF1dgTswQaHXmKtCwwtiDSfvcCxvYZxtEmQqrW1QX-2D2BO0L2t2ebEQRaqihkur4KWvoiyv1IT9msQtVY5TkN-2D2BYs-2D2FMV0wAqdlcwHT1xmIDM-2D2BRF3TAMQAi3BJkJseG68ZP3Ct8Wl7-2D2FfBgrHi3L75-2D2BBKyh5des-2D3D&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=6hj1Lnk2QEyFJf5FzOawN8MOxLXOeD3WB4g4muvvhxQ&s=UTrmheKc84iC-ZnKauVrRd7iS_omipTo5xjnZBUMh-U&e=> > See our latest work *here* > 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Penthouse, > 5th Floor, > 87-91 Newman Street > London > W1T 3EY > T +44 (0)20 7434 1182 > glassworks.co.uk > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__u7507473.ct.sendgrid.net_wf_click-3Fupn-3D5SmYwFIJXHmC5X9wAP0G6mg4oLGBuQENbeDkYXezg3m6vjHxJcC6rUMd8QE2MtqzI-2D2F9k-2D2BWBXKW27XRR1WxPwQSotdeaTQI8WptYwcBKkUcT-2D2FIjt1MdC-2D2BMj2Ij4Jo30z1VWeO7hEur0HeotmiSt52Imrnziiw55sG52DIKtyXdSxCxNgBQyreKDj5yryss91TPwLdOO2lfMt5FJdnz5x-2D2FNuHAwS0uz9jOUfWZWj74-2D2FW7jEGZqssihgwRoDz9hunoY1bsd9enCLD6o7FeopCIZ4T2ynNYTh0uPKx8RcqqBzOXnR2qSXJhzVMOrbiQlUd7R1s6i0Snbnh94nJeMCfdjgG9ueKJDZAzWcMyLcaRcxB-2D2FGrUbyIY4-2D2BoQKfA38xaggl-5FTu5-2D2BJTCp1P-2D2FbeHmYVbiMY-2D2Fu-2D2FFvGEdLx5Z1LcfzH7zq-2D2BPUBYya2x4weu8aeHJmRKnQx0akDIxU-2D2FyburP949QF1cvwBGJxyn3Mx5aDMhdqvhPYa-2D2FO-2D2FOqdMUBu1x6U1crIkf8dCxuhH1u1jCKuj0tCBr3gRSn9hknosaG4Y03BCubOhTg8PBtGIm-2D2Bdv5vTQPik4H6TeXziJNln9eIUmcrAE1BR0CBiRRQDG4rVKVgFy-2D2B-2D2BM-2D3D&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=6hj1Lnk2QEyFJf5FzOawN8MOxLXOeD3WB4g4muvvhxQ&s=-2IxNPOygJYB3U_RZa4ls1fDYbkPAcHfaGLz1jqF-Mo&e=> > Glassworks Terms and Conditions of Sale can be found at glassworks.co.uk > 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