Hi Chris,

Apples and Oranges.  In the context of the discussion, i.e. what a
designer can do, it's the designers responsibility to "demonstrate
compliance". For example, if you submit sprinkler plans and don't
declare a hazard we reject them based on the fact they we aren't able to
determine compliance with the standard. The hazard classification is
provided for in the sprinkler standard.  Likewise if you want to take
the QR Reduction Credit you need to tell us otherwise we're on different
pages.

But lets dispense with the formalities for a moment, wouldn't you agree
that submitting a code reference along with the design simplifies plan
review and thus approval ?.

So why not do what expedites the process ?

John Drucker

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chris
Cahill
Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2008 12:44 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: 13 system in SFR

Sorry John, as a law enforcement official you are obligated to show me
it's wrong.  I have no obligation to prove I'm right in any legal
context (well except maybe with the IRS).  Burden of proof is on the
gov't.  And in MN an AHJ has to point out the deficiency in writing and
give a reasonable time to comply before the gov't (AHJ) can take any
legal action.

Chris Cahill, P.E.
Fire Protection Engineer
Sentry Fire Protection, Inc.
 
763-658-4483
763-658-4921 fax
 
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
Mail: P.O. Box 69
        Waverly, MN 55390
 
Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW
              Waverly, MN 55390
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John
Drucker
Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2008 10:52 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: 13 system in SFR

Thom,

Real simple, I'm from Missouri, If you can show me it in the code then
you can do it.

As for money, agree 100% not the pervue of a municipal AHJ, and frankly
we are best left out of it which is why we just want to know how much
equipment for permitting purposes and not what it cost.

John Drucker 

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thom
McMahon
Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2008 11:34 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: 13 system in SFR

George: 

Just so you know where it came from the McMansion's are now being
replaced by the "McRanchion's" (Yes my own word, soon to be added to all
e-space word searches.)Buy a few hundred Ac. Hire a ranch manager, build
him a 1800Sf house, then build your 12,000 Sf part time residence, barn
and riding arena and claim "Ag" as your property tax bracket.
Of course if they need the tax break from Ag, they surly can't afford
anything more than the minimum 13D? Well who say's they need more than
13D?
Life Safety is the goal, and we all deserve equal access to that. So if
you have a McRanchion or a Tract Ranch house, both deserve the 13D
protection of a life safety system. For those that CAN afford more and
want to pay for it OK! But it should not be the AHJ that decides who can
and can't afford more.


It's that same old thing one AHJ we deal with allows 13D unabridged for
up to 5000Sf, a 13D 3three head design over 5000Sf, and a 13D 4 head
design @ 0.10 for any size home with a ceiling pitch over 8/12. (I don't
make these up, I just have to follow them.)

Thom McMahon, SET
Firetech, Inc.
2560 Copper Ridge Dr
P.O. Box 882136
Steamboat Springs, CO 80488
Tel:  970-879-7952
Fax: 970-879-7926


-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George
Church
Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2008 7:49 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: 13 system in SFR

"Nothing prevents an owner from increasing the level of protection
commiserate with the level of investment in a McMansion." 


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