Rod, Maybe I should have taken one more step. Forest, conscientious as he is, informs me, the good landlord, that either there is a requirement that the FM be informed and he would be negligent in not doing so, or he tells me that there is no requirement that he inform the FM but that this is so serious WE, as a team, should and that if I disagree he must for ethical and public safety reasons. Of course, I'm the good guy and want his and the FM's help to correct the most glaring and dangerous problems immediately (what my current wallet can bear) and a schedule for fixing the rest. The thing is the partnership with the client. No one likes finding themselves in hot water with authorities without warning. If I'm the other guy I've probably already been there often and so who cares?
On Sat, Nov 15, 2008 at 10:02 AM, Rod DiBona <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yep Ron I certainly can see what you are saying here. As with most of > these kind of issues it probably isn't black and white. In your scenario > I still believe that it would be better that the fire marshal be > informed. My reasoning is that it wouldn't hurt the good intentioned new > property owner but it would protect the public against so many others in > that situation that wouldn't have the same intention. I would think that > normally having the fire marshal know if there are problems with a > system is a good thing. If the owner is well intentioned then most FM's > that we deal with, will work with the owner to get things back in order. > It is only the owner that has no intention of correcting the problem > that this would adversely affect. The other argument has been that it is > the owners responsibility and he is paying you; so you work for him and > only report to him; so unless local ordinance dictates something else > you just do what you were hired to do. I can appreciate that, however in > Forest situation the owner (school district) or the inspecting > contractor(if there was one) was blatantly negligent in their > responsibility to maintain the system. If it was the inspecting > contractor like in your scenario, then the old guy needs to subrogate > that slander to the contractor. I find it ironic that the school > district was worried about their reputation with the fire marshal but > then turned around and slandered Forest and his company. Another classic > case of kill the messenger. At the end of the day I have a new > appreciation for our FM requirement to copy his department on all > inspections. I can tell any of our local clients in good conscience that > I am doing what I am required to do. This stuff is fun isn't it! > > Rod DiBona > Rapid Fire > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ron > Greenman > Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 9:48 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: inspection reports and copying fire marshals > > Rod, > > I agree with you but I'm going to play devil's advocate for the > moment. Try this scenario: I'm a good guy and I buy a bad property but > I have the intention of making it good. Hell, the old guy was a good > guy but he didn't know anything about fire stuff either and his > maintenance guys were Forest's competitors and he got a screw job. > Anyway, I own it now and I hire one of our outstanding forum FPEs to > perform a life safety analysis. Because he knows his stuff he hands me > a modest bill for his hard work and a punch list a mile long. After > recovering from the heart attack I realize it's going to take me a > long time to raise the money to pay for all these unanticipated costs > my FPE and I triage the work to immediate, soon and later. Now my FPE, > being a forum regular, knows that he's working for me and counsels me > that I should do everything as soon as possible but keeps our > conversations confidential. Next I hire Forest to do an NFPA 25 > inspection because I know the that I need to first know if the stuff I > do have works. If he finds disfunction per NFPA 25, 72, 12, 12A, 17A, > what have you, then he reports that to me. If our community has a > statute that requires him to report to the FM then he must but > otherwise it's all on me. And if there is a headline about "New > Slumlord in Town" they'd better be sure that that's my reputation > because I've already established in this scenario that I'm the good > guy that intends to make this property right. > > On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 8:20 AM, Rod DiBona <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: >> Yeah I can see the headline now "School district sues fire protection >> firm for disclosing life threatening conditions at our school to the >> fire marshal..." Ummmm good luck with that. I don't think you have >> anything to worry about. I would be curious to see who was doing the >> annual inspection of the system. Were there any main drain tags > showing >> the drop and rise back in pressure? We are REQUIRED to provide a >> duplicate copy of our inspections to the fire marshal. This is a good >> think because then we aren't the bad guy, just the messenger doing > what >> we have to. My guess is that your competitor will be doing the > repairs. >> >> Rod DiBona >> Rapid Fire >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 8:50 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: inspection reports and copying fire marshals >> >> I just had a school district call me and yell at me for a report I > did. >> I conducted a water flow test 2 months ago at this school. The water >> department and I observed that the PIV was shut. It had been shut for >> the past 6 years. >> Long story short the school asked me to open the valve and inspect for >> other problems. I spent an entire day surveying the school and wrote a >> 13 page report with pictures. Serious issues like rooms missing >> sprinklers. Ceiling clouds missing sprinklers etc. No drains or >> inspectors tests etc. >> I sent a copy to the fire marshal and building dept. Well fed ex >> delivered it to the fire marshal first and called the district before >> they got their copy. >> The school dist manager said that he emailed every school district in >> the area advising them not to use us and is threatening to sue us over >> sending a copy to the fire marshal. >> >> >> Forest Wilson >> Cherokee Fire >> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >> Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2008 07:56:27 >> To: <[email protected]> >> Subject: Seismic information Brownsville, TX - Monterrey, MX >> >> >> I am in desperate need of some seismic information for the area around >> Monterrey Mexico, >> >> Or someone familiar with the Mexican "Manual for Design of Seismic, >> CFE)? >> >> Here's the data I've gotten. I need to know if it parallels IBC as > far >> as when EQ bracing is required or if it's totally different and how >> these numbers and descriptions relate to IBC? >> >> "5.2.- Seismic Data: (Per Manual of Design for Seismic, CFE) >> Occupancy classification B >> Structural System classification Type 1 >> Soil Profile Type From geotechnical >> report >> Seismic Zone A >> Response Spectra c= 0.16 >> Ta= 0.30 >> Tb= 1.50 >> R= 2/3 >> Ductility Factor Q= 2" >> >> Thanks! >> >> >> Craig L. Prahl, CET >> Fire Protection Specialist >> Mechanical Department >> CH2MHILL >> Lockwood Greene >> 1500 International Drive >> PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 >> Direct - 864.599.4102 >> Fax - 864.599.8439 >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> http://www.ch2m.com >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum >> For Technical Assistance, send an email to: >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> To Unsubscribe, send an email >> to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum >> For Technical Assistance, send an email to: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> To Unsubscribe, send an email > to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >> > > > > -- > Ron Greenman > at home.... > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email > to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > -- Ron Greenman at home.... _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
