True and a good point. But in our defense only George knows what standard and year he is working from. Or even if the question to pockets was related to res heads. Or was that a second issue. I was a little confuseded but tried to help anyway. (the extra ed is a lame attempt at humor) But I don't see the pocket rule of '07 13R or 13D in '07 13. And just because it's in a newer standard doesn't mean that's what the future holds to be correct. I submit as evidence ch. 21 supposedly being changed in the '10 ed.
Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: [email protected] Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of ParsleyConsulting Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2009 12:03 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Residential Heads under Soffit Justin and Chris, Better take a look at the 2007 edition of NFPA-13D, which contains this section: 8.6.7 Sprinklers shall not be required for ceiling pockets that meet the following conditions: (1) The total volume of unprotected ceiling pocket does not exceed 100 ft3 (2.83 m3). (2) The entire floor under the unprotected ceiling pocket is protected by the sprinklers at the lower ceiling elevation. (3) Each unprotected ceiling pocket is separated from any adjacent unprotected ceiling pocket by a minimum 10 ft (3.05 m) horizontal distance. (4) The interior finish of the unprotected ceiling pocket is noncombustible or limited-combustible material. (5) Skylights not exceeding 32 ft2 (2.97 m2) shall be permitted to have a plastic cover. Sounds to me as though it would be just fine for him to have the sprinklers on the soffits if the volume of the pocket were less than 100 cubic feet Is that not accurate? Here's the text that Eric mentioned, from NFPA-13R, 2007: 6.8.1.5.4 Ceiling Pockets. 6.8.1.5.4.1 Sprinklers shall be required in all ceiling pockets. 6.8.1.5.4.2 The requirement of 6.8.1.5.4.1 shall not apply where all of the following requirements are met: (1) The total volume of the unprotected ceiling pocket does not exceed 100 ft3 (2.83 m3). (2) The depth of the unprotected ceiling pocket does not exceed 12 in. (305 mm). (3) The entire floor of the unprotected ceiling pocket is protected by the sprinklers at the lower ceiling elevation. (4) Each unprotected ceiling pocket is separated from any adjacent unprotected ceiling pocket by a minimum 10 ft (3.05 m) horizontal distance. (5) The interior finish of the unprotected ceiling pocket is noncombustible or limited-combustible construction. Slightly different, as it includes a maximum depth of 12", and there's no mention of skylights in the 13R sections. -- PARSLEY CONSULTING Ken Wagoner, SET 760.745.6181 voice 760.745.0537 fax [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> e-mail www.ParsleyConsulting.com <http://www.ParsleyConsulting.com> website Justin Reid wrote: > The ceiling pocket exception is not listed in the code for residential > heads. Switch to a standard or extended coverage heads instead. > > Any code developers know the reason why the ceiling pocket exception > was left out of the residential head section??? I am curious to know. > Justin D. Reid, P.E Chris Cahill wrote: > You are mixing 3 different issues. > > 1. If you can maintain a 12" deflector with non-residential heads the > pocket is irrelevant. But the 12" is complicated by the step ceiling > rule a > bit. If the res heads has a listing for 12" then the pocket is irrelevant. > > 2. Pockets are only under an option for SSU/SSP and ECUP/ECP not available > in the residential category. > > 3. Res heads have smaller location tolerance potentially modified by the > listing. > > Here's a question under a 36" pocket where you are using the pocket rules > how far down can the deflector be from the lower ceiling the head is in or > under? Seems to me one could put a head up to 12" below the lower ceiling > and thus have 4' from the deflector to the top of the pocket. In the > pocket > rule the 36" is clear it's the depth of the pocket not the depth to the > head. > Chris Cahill, P.E. _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
