Ron, Good advice. And we all need 'Dads' at some point in time (even us old guys). I can tell you that what I know of Greg he is an honorable guy and would never intentionally do the wrong thing. My hope is that it will turn out well for him and instead of it being a 'bad thing' that it turn out well for all involved.
Cliff -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ron Greenman Sent: Saturday, April 09, 2011 11:44 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: ENCLOSED COMBUSTIBLE STAIRS Greg, If it doesn't meet one of the allowable exceptions in 13, which it doesn't sound like it does, then you have only two choices. To force the issue or to pretend it doesn't exist. To do the latter is a dis-service to the owner who is expecting a proper job. The GC is the culprit. As I said, it is his job to coordinate the work and he has failed. in his responsibility to the owner. If he does not understand this then perhaps you're better off without him. Next he'll want you to glue heads to the ceiling. Once you take a small ignore a small thing in a conspiratorial manner (you and the GC hiding something from the owner and the AHJ) you have surrendered your morals, ethics, and ability to take a stand with that contractor for all time. You have also compromised yourself here. Of course this is difficult in these economic times, and it's easy for me to say from my cushy (or so I'm told) public employee position, but I can tell you I'm here because I had to leave a very lucrative management position when I took the side of a customer over that of my boss in a contract dispute because my boss (who has since done time in the Federal pokey for income tax issues) was trying to cheat a good, and honorable man, and I had to do the right thing, even if it cost me my job. Worked out well for me, but at the time being ethical was early scary as I was the sole source of income for five people and operating under a non-compete agreement. I'll tell you the whole story someday if you're interested but it was only over about $3000.00 dollars. And all I had to do was answer a yes or no question the other way to save my job and sell my soul. Now I'm feeling like your dad so I'll shut up. On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 8:38 AM, Greg McGahan <[email protected]> wrote: > That's not my option guys. We were hired to do two things, relocate heads > for the new wall and add two heads in a concealed space. The g.c. knowingly > blocked it in and sealed it off with no intentions for further actions on > his or our part. > > The only thing I can do is rationalize reasonably if possible why it is ok > as is or call the fire marshall as a whistle blower. > > That is an easy decision if you are not worried about losing the inspection > contract or being black listed by the general. > > So am I grasping for a legal straw? Absolutely. If those on the 13 commitee > and the majority of the rest believe it is too much of a stretch, then I > will play whistle blower.......we do NOT want to leave it unjustifyably > wrong. > Greg > On Apr 9, 2011 10:28 AM, "Thom" <[email protected]> wrote: >> Then I'd say have the GC drywall it and mmake it a concealed > Non-combustible >> space. Or just blow it full of insul. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] >> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg > McGahan >> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 3:19 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: ENCLOSED COMBUSTIBLE STAIRS >> >> No, it is not a room, it is a combustible concealed space UNDER an area > ... >> >> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:13 PM, Thom <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> It's not truly the "Space over the small room" it is the small room. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: [email protected] >>> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg >>> McGahan >>> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 2:44 PM >>> To: [email protected] >>> Subject: ENCLOSED COMBUSTIBLE STAIRS >>> >>> We were hired to put 2 heads under a new combustible set of stairs that >>> were >>> added as an emergency egress in an existing LH building. The GC "forgot" >>> and >>> enclosed the stairs - space approximately 3-6 x 18' long - and finished >> the >>> space. We still have to relocate a couple of heads in an adjacent area so >>> we >>> are not completely free of any obligations there. Note that this space is >>> under a one floor stair and contains NOTHING, no wires, pipes, ducts, etc >>> except the framing. >>> >>> Question: Is there any chance this would even be in the same ballpark as >>> the >>> exception in chapter 8.15.1.2.9 for spaces over isolated small >>> rooms.....Since a permit was not required on this project, the AHJ does >> not >>> know about it and the only question is morally how hard we push this >>> situation. >>> >>> Thanks for your thoughts. >>> Greg >>> >>> -- >>> Greg McGahan >>> Living Water Fire Protection, LLC <http://www.livingwaterfp.com> >>> 1160 McKenzie Road >>> Cantonment, FL 32533 >>> 850-937-1850 >>> fax 850-937-1852 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum >>> >>> For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] >>> >>> To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] >>> (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum >>> >>> For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] >>> >>> To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] >>> (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Greg McGahan >> Living Water Fire Protection, LLC <http://www.livingwaterfp.com> >> 1160 McKenzie Road >> Cantonment, FL 32533 >> 850-937-1850 >> fax 850-937-1852 >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum >> >> For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] >> >> To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] >> (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum >> >> For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] >> >> To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] >> (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > -- Ron Greenman Instructor Fire Protection Engineering Technology Bates Technical College 1101 So. Yakima Ave. Tacoma, WA 98405 [email protected] http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/ 253.680.7346 253.576.9700 (cell) Member: ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
