If I am following – staying within the walls makes it a ‘room design method’. You can ignore the walls and do an area/density… or stay in the walls, but then it is not technically and ‘area/density’. So yes, but no…
If I am following correctly (?)…. Matt From: Sprinklerforum <[email protected]> On Behalf Of cliff--- via Sprinklerforum Sent: Friday, August 09, 2019 2:04 PM To: [email protected] Cc: [email protected] Subject: RE: ESFR Calc's Do you ignore the walls if rated when using area/density method or does the rating cause you to have to stay within the limits of the rated walls? Thanks, Cliff Whitfield, SET President Fire Design, Inc. 184 Comfort Place Burnsville, NC 28714 Ph: 828-284-4772 [cid:[email protected]] From: Sprinklerforum <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> On Behalf Of Roland Huggins Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2019 2:16 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: ESFR Calc's Bullseye We IGNORE walls unless rated and using the room design approach is the starting point Roland [Image removed by sender.] Roland Huggins, PE Senior Vice President, Engineering & Technical Services American Fire Sprinkler Association p: 214-349-5965 ext121 w: firesprinkler.org<http://firesprinkler.org> [Image removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> [Image removed by sender.] <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> [Image removed by sender.] <https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/> [Image removed by sender.] <https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> 4 days. 1,500+ attendees. AFSA38: Convention, Exhibition, & Apprentice Competition is North America's largest fire sprinkler trade event. Join us at the Manchester Grand Hyatt in beautiful San Diego, California October 1-4, 2019. On Jul 10, 2019, at 10:17 AM, Sean.VanGaal <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Do what Mike said but pick up the 12th sprinkler off the 4th line. I would imagine the intent of NFPA 13 was to calculated 4 sprinklers on a line as your worst case scenario to prove the line size. Then pickup 12 sprinklers total to get an appropriate total flow. So the standard reference 3 lines to do this as that is the common scenario. Applying this assumption to your scenario, your 1st two lines have at least 4 sprinklers per line so those are easy enough. Your 3rd line only has 3 sprinklers so pickup all 3 and then pick up the 4th sprinkler on the 4th line. You now have 12 total sprinklers flowing, and the last 4 of these sprinklers are going to overflow more than they normally would if they were on a single line (assuming tree/end fed system). So this should be a more conservative design than what NFPA 13 requires. But you also aren’t forcing yourself to go ultra conservative by calculating 5 or 6 sprinklers on a single line which I do not believe was NFPA 13’s intent. Thanks, Sean VG From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Tuesday, July 9, 2019 7:44 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: [EXTERNAL] RE: ESFR Calc's Mike- The lines on the other side of the wall only have (3) heads per line. Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. bvssytemsinc.com<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2furldefense.proofpoint.com%2fv2%2furl%3fu%3dhttp-3A__bvssystemsinc.com_%26d%3dDwMFAg%26c%3dwn3mZQLIuInh2ClcJ0_DIA%26r%3dXSIweKhAHHhyB-d63TCLaTQ55VHpbhIhFOxEPFjbNpg%26m%3dAWdzKMSnfZTO1yzpl1Dd37Lrr1TeI1Fqx3BWjEHd-Zg%26s%3dQGuUWxAksuh7c7L6oHoglZLzKjOOXn6OYIs8o4Fgsv4%26e%3d&c=E,1,IQ7WhCt--snmnvIkJM0LHUmqHXCkIg_L7g1Df4FHelrMgcQbWaaAvXsIawO3M2usca8FLhOk8wR11c9J30nAF3iJDEszud-GudvoVyH7Gr1jxlMOsUTx&typo=1> From: Sprinklerforum <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> On Behalf Of Mike Hairfield Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2019 10:36 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: ESFR Calc's Why don't you use 2 lines on one side of the wall and 1 line on the other side of the wall thus 3 lines with 4 heads? Mike ________________________________ From: Sprinklerforum <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> on behalf of Brian Harris <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Sent: Tuesday, July 9, 2019 10:29 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: ESFR Calc's I have an ESFR system that I do not have (3) rows of (4) heads to calc. Due to compartment wall layouts I have (2) rows of (6) heads and (6) rows of (3) heads. What is the best way to grab (12) heads? Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. Design Manager bvssystemsinc.com<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2furldefense.proofpoint.com%2fv2%2furl%3fu%3dhttp-3A__bvssystemsinc.com_%26d%3dDwMFAg%26c%3dwn3mZQLIuInh2ClcJ0_DIA%26r%3dXSIweKhAHHhyB-d63TCLaTQ55VHpbhIhFOxEPFjbNpg%26m%3dAWdzKMSnfZTO1yzpl1Dd37Lrr1TeI1Fqx3BWjEHd-Zg%26s%3dQGuUWxAksuh7c7L6oHoglZLzKjOOXn6OYIs8o4Fgsv4%26e%3d&c=E,1,zCH3MnJaPM-ynkRsnruKsqcwOShstOOsvakHXet_iTdwmwgHrBG2UMZ-gqkw_FBhLTSqf_ifoM-dAlC_ivqblAvuwdpb6wmoxmanqPEdGl4jBfl0nOU,&typo=1> Phone: 704.896.9989 Fax: 704.896.1935 _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org [https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif]<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient&utm_term=icon> Virus-free. www.avast.com<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient&utm_term=link>
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