Just want to throw another data point into this confusing discussion.

The low-end Cisco ASA 5505 requires VLAN configuration since it is
just a switch.

The Cisco ASA 5510 has four Ethernet ports. If you need more, just use VLAN.

Perhaps, Cisco is expecting a firewalled network to use managed
switches. Is it best practice? Why is there a resistance to VLAN in
the pfSense community?

I had somebody asked about at least ten port pfSense router with
ability adding more as needed. He wants to provide Internet to a
building but wants each tenant to be on a separate network. I asked
why doesn't he just use a managed switch and trunk everybody to the
router?

I sold a Cisco Catalyst 3500XL with 48 Fast Ethernet ports for $35 a
couple of months ago on eBay. I don't think cost is the issue.

Bao

On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 10:08 AM, Adam Thompson <[email protected]> wrote:
> Comments from another perspective on the must/should question:
>
> Best practice says to physically segregate networks by trust level and by
> impact of error or breach.
>
> Somewhat self-evidently, this is to mitigate the impact of a) errors, and
> b) security breaches.  Of the two, errors (i.e. human errors) are by far
> the more common problem.
>
> If you have a separate NIC for each network coming in to your firewall,
> the cables are well-identified, the ports are well-identified, and the
> other endpoint of those cables is also well-identified, it's much harder
> to accidentally expose high-trust traffic to a low-trust network.
> Specifically, it's far likelier that someone will notice that the cable
> they're holding has an "AT&T" tag on it but the port they're about to plug
> it into has a "PacBell" label over it.
>
> When you use a switch and VLANs to segregate traffic, you have to worry
> about things like: in a pathological power situation (lightning strike,
> UPS blows up, whatever) if the switch is suddenly reset to factory
> defaults - and I've seen this happen - what will happen?  Every port gets
> reset to VLAN 1 with no filtering, and all your traffic is suddenly being
> propagated to every network segment.
>
> Maybe you're thinking "big deal", but now consider the fairly-typical WAN
> situation where you're running routing protocols across WAN links, say
> RIPv2 without authentication (because you trust all the networks involved,
> right?  It's a point-to-point link, right?).  Your network topology
> suddenly collapses and takes [fixing or unplugging]+2hrs to reconverge.
>
> Or the situation I once found: two smallish WAN providers both (stupidly)
> left STP turned on at the edge... when they were suddenly bridged together
> (by accident, I made a typo when setting up the VLANs) I managed to take
> down most of both providers' networks, and typical of STP both were down
> for <time to figure out what I did and fix it>+5 minutes.  Obviously I
> wasn't happy, and when we all figured out what had happened they weren't
> very happy with me, either.
>
> As to security breaches, it is extremely difficult to a) know about the
> switch, b) target the switch, and c) hack the switch, but it's
> *infinitely* harder to hack a piece of Cat5 cable than a switch!
>
> Having said all that, many of the firewall modules/blades you can buy for
> chassis-based routers and switches (Cisco 3600 ISR, Catalyst 10000,
> Juniper [something], etc.) require you to configure their ports entirely
> using VLANs anyway.
>
> So it's hardly a universal "must", certainly not in the technical sense -
> it's a very, very strong "should" that you should only disregard if a)
> you're overconfident of your own abilities, b) you have no truly private
> data, c) you don't care too much about pissing off your WAN providers (or
> you know they won't even notice!), and d) you don't have enough space to
> mount one or two more switches in the server closet.
>
> Note also that you might be tempted to use 802.1q-over-802.3ad
> (VLAN-over-LAG), which does work... but also generally speaking turns off
> a lot of the hardware acceleration your NIC can do for you.  Many NICs
> (certainly any half-decent one!) can still do IP offload with 802.1q (VLAN
> tagging), but I haven't run into any that can still do IP offload with
> 802.3ad (link aggregation, aka "bonding", or "etherchannel").  Bundling
> links together (LAG) actually slowed my router down instead of speeding it
> up.
>
> Another aspect is that if you're going to run your router in a blade
> chassis, say, (virtualized or not) you really won't have much choice but
> to use VLANs for everything - most blade chassis don't give you dedicated
> physical Ethernet ports, certainly not more than two on any I've seen.
> Most of 'em have an embedded NIC (or two, or four...) that plug straight
> into a backplane and are only exposed via a switch module.
>
> (I am also noticing that pfSense 1.2.3 does not have good performance (for
> me, at least) forwarding traffic between "virtual switches" on a VMWare
> ESXi 4 host connected to the switch through a 4x V-in-LAG trunk.  I
> haven't had time to isolate the problem yet, although I observed slightly
> better performance when I let VMWare handle the VLAN tagging instead of
> pfSense (i.e. created 4 untagged virtual e1000 NICs instead of 1 tagged
> vnic).  Performance only seems affected if either ingress or egress
> traffic is local to the ESXi host, I see more-or-less normal performance
> if both src and dst are off-host.)
>
> -Adam Thompson
>  [email protected]
>
>
>
>
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-- 
Best Regards.
Bao C. Ha
Hacom OpenBrick Distributor USA http://www.hacom.net
voice: (714) 564-9932
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