What point are you trying to convey when you say this Lyle? > That strikes me as a bargain compared to creating biodiesel and > combusting it for electrons.
You don't even have the numbers relative to production efficiencies for biodiesel to electricity and you draw such a conclusion? Much less construction/manufacturing cradle-to-grave energy inputs for both options (inclusive of mining, smelting, kilns, transport, labor transportation, etc, etc, etc.) Maybe if you worked both equations you could come up with a definitive opinion. But to do so based upon a feeling? That doesn't fly. Todd Swearingen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lyle Estill" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 8:12 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Back to grid via WVO genset > You are right. Efficient might be the wrong word. Perhaps "bargain" > would be a better choice, > 65% energy loss from end to end? To deliver electrons to Rob's guitar? > > That strikes me as a bargain compared to creating biodiesel and > combusting it for electrons. > > I just figured the energy loss from end to end would be much worse with > a little generator compared to the grid. > > On Oct 8, 2004, at 1:28 PM, Appal Energy wrote: > > > Lyle, > > > >> Is it not true that the grid is so much more efficient than Rob's > >> generator that making electricity from biodiesel is a waste of > >> perfectly good fuel? > > > > I don't know about that. Do you think that an approximate 65% loss in > > energy > > from fuel source to your duplex outlet is very efficient? > > > > That's the loss achieved by the grid that provides electrical service > > to > > you. > > > > You may be right about a fairly needless waste of biodiesel, however. > > Especially when gensets operate under constant load and for the most > > part > > are capable of running on WVO/SVO. The inclusion of more energy inputs > > by > > making biodiesel might be unnecessary in many instances. > > > > Todd Swearingen > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Lyle Estill" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 9:34 PM > > Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Back to grid via WVO genset > > > > > >> Gang, > >> > >> I've enjoyed this thread for awhile now, and have finally found the > >> courage to post. > >> > >> Is it not true that the grid is so much more efficient than Rob's > >> generator that making electricity from biodiesel is a waste of > >> perfectly good fuel? > >> > >> From a conservation standpoint (strictly BTUs--forget geopolitical > >> arguments for a moment), he is better off running his studio on grid. > >> > >> > >> On Oct 7, 2004, at 11:23 PM, Appal Energy wrote: > >> > >>> Kirk, > >>> > >>> Did that fellow say that "every China diesel owner achieved in excess > >>> of > >>> 10,000 hours?" Or was he only pointing to the exceptions? It would > >>> also be a > >>> rather rare truck that got one million miles before it had to have > >>> the > >>> top > >>> end and rings done. 300-500,000 is a more real breaking point there. > >>> You're > >>> also speaking of relatively small horsepower and not a great deal of > >>> engine > >>> mass. Don't think you can compare the odd duck of a truck to the > >>> whole > >>> roost. > >>> > >>> Todd Swearingen > >>> > >>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> From: "Kirk McLoren" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 8:26 PM > >>> Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Back to grid via WVO genset > >>> > >>> > >>>> That fellow "Skip" who wrote "More Power to You" said he knew China > >>>> diesel > >>> owners that had in excess of 10,000 hours without a rebuild. We know > >>> trucks > >>> go 1000000 miles and at an avg of 50mph that is 20.000 hours > >>>> > >>>> Kirk > >>>> > >>>> Appal Energy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>>> Robert, > >>>> > >>>>> What is the flaw I am missing? > >>>> > >>>> You don't use all 2,000 kWh in 2-3 hour blocks. To make your idea > >>>> work > >>>> without a storage system you would have to conduct all your energy > >>> consuming > >>>> activities within that narrow time window. You'd probably be best > >>>> served > >>> by > >>>> installing a battery bank and converter and cycle your gennie as > >>>> required. > >>>> > >>>> You've also got to "depreciate" your gennie. Check the > >>>> manufacturer's > >>>> estimated life cycle. Usually they're only 2-3 thousand hours > >>>> before a > >>>> rebuild is necessary, meaning that you'll be buying a new gennie or > >>>> paying > >>>> the rebuild costs every second or third year. > >>>> > >>>> Todd Swearingen > >>>> > >>>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>>> From: "Robert Del Bueno" > >>>> To: > >>>> Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2004 10:11 PM > >>>> Subject: [Biofuel] Back to grid via WVO genset > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> So looking at my power bill for my recording studio business, we > >>>>> use > >>>>> on > >>>>> average about 2000kWH per month. > >>>>> If I were to run a 30kW diesel genset on SVO for 2.5 hours a day, > >>>>> 30 > >>> days > >>>> a > >>>>> month... > >>>>> > >>>>> 75Hx30kW=2250kWH ... > >>>>> > >>>>> I know that net-metering in Georgia does not pay retail rates for > >>> intertie > >>>>> power, but hell, even if I had to run for 3-4 hours a day, seems > >>>>> like I > >>>>> could do well. > >>>>> Of course using a water cooled genset, I would also use the hot > >>>>> water > >>> for > >>>>> heating applications. > >>>>> I have a steady supply of good SVO. > >>>>> And 30kw diesel genset available very affordable. > >>>>> I know the intertie/net metering equipment costs a fair amount, but > >>>>> will > >>>> be > >>>>> applicable for future solar pv use as well. > >>>>> > >>>>> What is the flaw I am missing? > >>>>> -Rob > >>>>> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> Biofuel mailing list > >>>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>>>> http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel > >>>>> > >>>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > >>>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > >>>>> > >>>>> Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): > >>>>> http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> Biofuel mailing list > >>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>>> http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel > >>>> > >>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > >>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > >>>> > >>>> Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): > >>>> http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> --------------------------------- > >>>> Do you Yahoo!? > >>>> Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> Biofuel mailing list > >>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>>> http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel > >>>> > >>>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > >>>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > >>>> > >>>> Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): > >>>> http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ > >>>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Biofuel mailing list > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel > >>> > >>> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > >>> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > >>> > >>> Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): > >>> http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ > >>> > >> Lyle Estill > >> V.P. Stuff > >> Piedmont Biofuels > >> www.biofuels.coop > >> 919-545-2551 > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Biofuel mailing list > >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel > >> > >> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > >> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > >> > >> Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): > >> http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Biofuel mailing list > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > > > Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): > > http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ > > > Lyle Estill > Blast Internet Services > www.blast.com > 919-545-2551 > > _______________________________________________ > Biofuel mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): > http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ > _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
