Zeke Yewdall wrote: >Interesting. I know that several people in Boulder have had issues >with unwashed biodiesel running very poorly in the TDI's -- even pre >PDI ones (one commercial reseller here sells unwashed biodiesel made >from WVO), whereas others of us use it with no problems at all, in >1980's diesels.
As Todd says, things don't break until they break. (Um, I think I got it right, or was it nothing breaks until it's broken?) >But properly washed biodiesel does not seem to be an >issue with the TDI's. Properly made and properly washed. >On the soy vs rapeseed, why is the US so fixated on soy? Smacks of a >powerful soybean lobby to me. I believe you'll find (ta-dah!) the list archives a rich source of information on Big Soy and its influence on the biodiesel industry in the US, and what European car manufacturers tend to think of that when it comes to issuing warranties in the US. >From what little I know of the farming >practices, rapeseed can be grown in much harsher climates (winter >wheat territory), and doesn't require as much irrigation as soybeans. >Seems to be a much more sustainable crop. Since this is Big Ag we're talking about with powerful lobbies and so on, I should say that industrialised monocrops of rapeseed aren't any more sustainable than industrialised monocrops of soy or of anything else. Both are heavily reliant on fossil-fuel inputs anyway, hardly a way to grow sustainable green clean biofuels. Or not for much longer. Soy's a legume at least, it fixes some soil N, though not as much as other legumes. Both soy and rapeseed can be and are grown sustainably. For rapeseed you need an oilseed press to extract the oil, but you can't press soy oil, it's solvent-extracted, usually with hexane. Soy oil has a higher iodine number than rapeseed, which excludes it in Europe, which of course has its rapeseed lobby, but the soy exclusioon in the EU biodiesel standards has a real basis, oxidation is a problem. Rapeseed oil is a better lubricant than soy oil, but all vegetable oils are good lubricants anyway. Castor oil is about the best, very interesting biofuels crop. >Interestingly, my dad's 1953 bulldozer is technically a PD system as >well, although completely mechanical. I haven't tried running it on >biodiesel or SVO, but I doubt it would have trouble. Probably not. The tractors in the German "100 tractors" program aren't old tractors. They're these things, with advanced diesel motors: http://www.deutz-fahr.de/english/traktoren/agrotronttv/ DEUTZ-FAHR | Agrotron TTV http://www.deutz-fahr.de/english/traktoren/agrotronttv/motor.php DEUTZ-FAHR | Agrotron TTV - Engine DEUTZ-FAHR | Agrotron TTV - Technical data http://www.deutz-fahr.de/english/traktoren/pdf/ttvdatenblatt.pdf Keith >On 9/26/05, Keith Addison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Zeke Yewdall wrote: > > > > > > Anyway, if you do mean biodiesel, there wouldn't be much point in > > > > making a list, biodiesel works in all diesel engines. > > > > > > > > > >Is there anyone on this list running biodiesel in the CRD engines? I > > >have heard rumors (mostly from the same people who claim that > > >biodiesel will ruin any diesel engine, which is obviously disproven) > > >that it can polymerize in the injector lines. > > > > CRD = Common-Rail Direct Injection? There's been an argument, mostly > > in the US, over whether the new VW models from 2004 on fitted with > > Pumpe Düse unit injection, PDIs, or PDs (injector and pump are > > integrated into a single unit), are suitable for biodiesel. > > > > The message from Rob Del Bueno I referred to in the Landcruiser > > thread also said this: > > > > >Currently I resell commercial manufactured biodiesel in Atlanta, GA. > > >Over the past 2 years I have seen the quality of this fuel vary greatly. > > >The vehicles that seemed most prone to having issues with the >variable fuel > > >quality where the 2004/2005 VWs. > > >In 2004 evidently VW started using a high pressure common-rail direct > > >injection fuel system, which provides a bit more HP, but is much more > > >sensitive to fuel quality issues. > > > > > >This is not to say you should avoid the new VWs...just make sure >you have a > > >way of verifying the quality of the biodiesel you will be using in it. > > > > Quality, yes. The VWs are PDIs, not common-rail. Here's an > > explanation of common-rail: > > > > http://www.autozine.org/technical_school/engine/diesel.htm#Common-Rail > > AutoZine Technical School - Engine > > > > I don't know of any problems running common-rail diesels on biodiesel. > > > > Here's an explanation of Pumpe Düse unit injection: > > > > http://www.volkswagen.co.uk/new_cars/technology_glossary/Pumpe_Duse > > Volkswagen > New Cars > Technical Glossary > > Pump Duse > > > > The PDI controversy doesn't seem to extend to Europe, where, never > > mind biodiesel, advanced PDI diesels are converted for SVO use with > > professional single-tank SVO systems (with special injectors and > > glow-plugs optimised for SVO use, as well as fuel pre-heating), some > > of them in a government-backed scheme (the German "100 tractors" > > program). See, eg: > > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg38556.html > > RE: [Biofuel] 2004 VW Jetta TDI > > > > The original Elsbett 3-cylinder DI multi-fuel diesel engine designed > > for either SVO or petro-diesel had Pumpe Düse unit injection (which I > > think Elsbett first developed, along with DI diesels for passenger > > cars). > > > > So yes, biodiesel works in all diesel engines, as long as it's > > good-quality biodiesel. Always the same proviso. Not that it's any > > problem making good-quality biodiesel. > > > > I wonder how high-pressure such as with a CRD would cause biodiesel > > to polymerise. Oxidation might do that, more so with soy-based than > > with rapeseed oil-based biodiesel, especially if you bubble-wash it. > > But there are standards for oxidation limits too, at least in Europe > > (and Australia, and soon in Japan). The US seems to be in denial > > about it because soy doesn't qualify. > > > > Best wishes > > > > Keith _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
