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AFAIK, all the major SIGPLAN conferences already provide a remote option for virtual participation. It is possible that there have been exceptions, but that is the post-Covid/PACMPL norm. I'm not sure what you're proposing re: geographically distributing paper presentations -- what is "vire"? -- but it sounds complicated. Derek On Tue, Sep 23, 2025 at 6:19 PM Peter Sewell <[email protected]> wrote: > Straightforwardly actionable, and I think a no-brainer: we can ensure that > remote participation is (imperfect though it is) uniformly available. > > Not completely straightforward logistically, but I imagine doable: we > could allow authors to freely vire paper presentations among the SIGPLAN > conferences, and ensure that those are geographically distributed. There'd > be some hit to the the character and critical-mass-of-related-people, but > that might well be worthwhile. > > Peter > > > On Tue, 23 Sept 2025 at 17:10, Derek Dreyer <[email protected]> wrote: > >> [ The Types Forum, >> http://lists.seas.upenn.edu/mailman/listinfo/types-list ] >> >> Thanks for the lively discussion about this issue. However, I'm afraid I >> must disagree with the opinions posted so far that advocated for >> (temporarily) abandoning conferences in the US. >> >> Of course, many people in our community are understandably upset because >> of >> the actions of the Trump administration and its effect on immigration and >> research. I, too, am very upset about it (to put it mildly). >> >> But it seems to me there are multiple different issues being conflated in >> Gabriel's original post, and the proposed cure is worse than the disease. >> In particular, he wrote: "It is pretty clear that the US are not a safe >> place for universities right now, and also unpalatable-to-unsafe for >> people >> (especially foreigners) working in universities." >> >> Concerning the point that the US is not a safe place for universities: I >> am >> not exactly sure what he meant, but I assume he meant that universities >> are >> suffering under the major funding cuts and generally threatening behavior >> of the Trump administration. This is certainly true. However, it is not >> clear to me how holding an academic conference outside the US for a couple >> years will sway Trump to do something different. Furthermore, when >> considering other conference locations, I do not recall it ever having >> been >> a priority to select locations based on whether the local government was >> particularly supportive of science. Even in its diminished state, the US >> government will still be a major contributor to global research funding. >> >> Concerning the point that the US is "unpalatable-to-unsafe for people >> (especially foreigners) working in universities", I again am not >> completely >> sure what this is referring to. If this is referring to non-US citizens >> working in universities in the US, who might have their visas revoked on >> whatever proclamation Trump thinks up tomorrow, yes, this is really bad. >> But as has already been noted by Julia and others, it is *much* easier for >> those people to attend conferences in the US than elsewhere. If on the >> other hand this is referring to people travelling to the US for the >> conference, I heard a few horror stories earlier this year, but I have not >> seen evidence that there is widespread harassment of academics entering >> the >> US for a conference. So I think the chance of encountering a problem is >> very low. But I agree that this is a valid cause for concern, and I can >> understand if people are hesitant to travel to the US because of it. >> >> Others on the thread have suggested improving our virtual conference >> participation options so that US researchers can participate even if the >> event is held elsewhere. I am all for improving virtual conference >> participation, but we had several years of experimentation with that >> during >> the pandemic, and in the end the verdict seemed to be that it didn't >> really >> work. At least it is not a replacement for in-person participation. But >> I >> think if people are motivated enough, and enough people do not want to >> travel to the US for conferences, then it would be a great idea to >> experiment with satellite meetings, also for climate reasons. >> >> In summary, given that a very significant portion of our community >> includes >> people working at US universities, I think that we should not abandon >> conferences in the US entirely. We could, however, consider reducing the >> frequency with which conferences are located in the US (e.g. to no more >> than 1/2 or some smaller fraction of the time), as well as exploring >> complementary options like satellite meetings. >> >> Best wishes, >> Derek >> >> P.S. In response to Artem's question, I would not consider the discussion >> on this list to necessarily be representative of the "stance" of the PL >> community on this issue. It may be worth gauging the stance of the >> research community, but that may be best done with post-conference surveys >> at some upcoming SIGPLAN conferences. >> >> On Tue, Sep 23, 2025 at 5:17 PM Artem Shinkarov <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > [ The Types Forum, >> http://lists.seas.upenn.edu/mailman/listinfo/types-list >> > ] >> > >> > Hi >> > >> > It appears that the argument regarding being "trapped in" is diverting >> the >> > discussion from the intent of the original post: the toxic attitude of >> the >> > US towards research and researchers, which requires action from the >> > research community. Ban on conferences in the US could serve as a >> > meaningful statement or gesture that we ought to consider. >> > >> > The issue of being "trapped in" is indeed one of the drawbacks >> highlighted >> > in the original post. However, this situation is not unique to the US; >> > similar challenges arise in other countries as well. For instance, >> > individuals on visas in the UK may find themselves unable to travel to >> > Europe, the US, and beyond. As noted in previous discussions, we can >> > address this issue by ensuring adequate online participation and >> exploring >> > the possibility of satellite events. Nevertheless, the crucial question >> > remains: is the research community prepared to express its stance on >> this >> > matter, and what is the most effective way to do so? >> > >> > >> > >> > Cheers, >> > Artem >> > >> > >> > >> > On Tuesday, September 23rd, 2025 at 1:36 PM, Niki Vazou < >> > [email protected]> wrote: >> > >> > > >> > > >> > > [ The Types Forum, >> > http://lists.seas.upenn.edu/mailman/listinfo/types-list ] >> > > >> > > Hey, >> > > >> > > I also agree that moving is getting more complicated (both for the >> > > geopolitical events and the environment...) >> > > So, maybe a good alternative would be, in parallel to the main event, >> to >> > > have satellite events. For example, when a conference happens in USA, >> to >> > > have participants gather in another country to attend/participate. >> > > >> > > Best, >> > > Niki >> > > >> > > On Mon, Sep 22, 2025 at 5:35 PM Julia Belyakova [email protected] >> wrote: >> > > >> > > > [ The Types Forum, >> > http://lists.seas.upenn.edu/mailman/listinfo/types-list >> > > > ] >> > > > >> > > > I don't disagree that the US is not a welcome destination for many >> > people >> > > > right now. >> > > > >> > > > I did want to point out the existence of the trapped-in-the-US >> > > > international community because in my experience, a lot of people, >> > > > understandably, are not aware of this phenomenon. >> > > > >> > > > In general, there are many reasons why an individual cannot travel >> to a >> > > > particular location, be it the US or another country. >> > > > >> > > > To be constructive, I would like to amplify an alternative >> suggestion >> > > > discussed in Zulip, which is to have an explicit policy for >> presenting >> > the >> > > > paper at a different conference that is held in a more suitable >> > location >> > > > for the author. Similar to what SIGPLAN-track has been doing at >> SPLASH. >> > > > >> > > > Of course, it would require more coordination across the conferences >> > and an >> > > > additional logistics burden on organizers. >> > > > >> > > > -- >> > > > Kind regards, Julia >> > > > >> > > > >> > >> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://julbinb.github.io/__;!!IBzWLUs!WAX7xyBsdZT3oMFK0lm5dFmak5nvWszH_Tt-tl_8MyRugaEYzh3Sm-WminTMTReV3LLNlPUOJIjBk-3FDMWtDsPMfds$ >> > > > >> > > > On Mon, Sep 22, 2025, 12:27 AM Sanjiva Prasad >> [email protected] >> > > > wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > So ia=s my son (for INS reasons) -- could not attend ECOOP or CAV >> > this >> > > > > year where he had best papers. >> > > > > >> > > > > But computer science is not a US monopoly (not even in ACM now, >> > though >> > > > > registered in the US). >> > > > > It costs Indians and Chinese and some others USD250 over the visa >> > costs >> > > > > just to enter the US. >> > > > > Am not saying that getting into Europe or India is easier, but US >> is >> > not >> > > > > a welcome destination for many right now. >> > > > > >> > > > > On 22/09/25 04:18, Julia Belyakova wrote: >> > > > > >> > > > > > [ The Types Forum, >> > > > > > http://lists.seas.upenn.edu/mailman/listinfo/types-list ] >> > > > > > >> > > > > > I understand this position but just want to remind that there >> are >> > many >> > > > > > international students and professionals in the community who >> are >> > stuck >> > > > > > inside the US and cannot cross the border, even to go Canada. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > I, for one, have been stuck in the US since 2020. >> > > > > >> > > > > -- >> > > > > Sanjiva Prasad >> > > > > Professor, Department of Computer Science and Engineering >> > > > > Indian Institute of Technology Delhi (IIT Delhi) >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > -- >> > > Niki Vazou >> > >> >
