With such nice groundwork laid out, it should be *easier* to sell it.
Congrats in advance =).
Ernesto Reinaldo Barreiro wrote:
Hi Lester,
What I have done is implement the same "mini" application in several
technologies:
-Struts + Spring + Hibernate
-Seam + JSF + Hibernate
-Wicket + Spring/Guice + Hibernate
With detailed explanations of how things work...
Additionally I have created a more complex prototype of another
application, done in Wicket +Spring/Guice, which shows advanced
functionality like:
-Auto-CRUDs panels, generated out of annotated POJOs, with grids supporting
column reordering via drag-drop, export to Excel, PDF, etc.
-Workspace like functionality: a page where users can work with different
floating panels as in a desktop. One of these windows contains an AJAX
driven wizard and the others are search screens the user can use to check
information while using the wizard...
-Trees, Palettes, Grids, etc.
In a couple of weeks we have some training sessions... and after that a
decision will be taken...
Regards,
Ernesto
On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 10:28 AM, Lester Chua <[email protected]> wrote:
Hi Ernesto,
Cant offer much advise here myself. The others have already great tips as
well as morale support.
If you are up to it, you should do a fair-sized prototype (with
multi-forms/multi girds+ajax in typical pages) and just kick their arses.
In my situation, we did a mini project with it and were just blow away with
the results.
I find it frustrating when technical evaluators do not sit down and get
their hands dirty while making decisions that will affect whole companies'
competitiveness and productivity.
When making recommendations, we should do a detailed hands on the
technology and should not just cut and paste whatever we find off the web
and present it as having done our research. Doing tutorials only are also
dangerous as they typically cover only a small subset of use cases and
normally do not illustrate the complex UI's that can arises from users
requests.
Regards,
Lester
Ernesto Reinaldo Barreiro wrote:
Hi Lester,
Right now I'm in a similar situation: I'm working for a company that wants
to (possibly) change from struts 1.X to something else and it is my job
"present" the choices to the developers and managers, so that they can
decide which will be the next framework the company will adopt for WEB
development. I'm also trying to get Wicket adopted over the other
candidates
but that won't be easy...
I fully agree with Jonathan: the only thing PHBs care about is theirs own
personal interests... So, they pay special attention to keep themselves
"on
the safe side of the fence".
Cheers,
Ernesto
On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 8:17 AM, Lester Chua <[email protected]>
wrote:
Jonathan,
Bingo, I think you may have hit it on the spot.
Igor,
I have not managed to get a reply on how they determined Struts2 to be
better supported compared to Wicket. But I suspect the list of a approved
technologies is not very updated. I.e. the evaluation was probably done 2
years ago.
Thanks for all the responses. The anecdotes and points made were very
helpful and have helped out get out of my depression over the weekend.
And I
have written a long and hopefully thoughtful reply to the technical
committee and will keep you guys posted.
Lester
Jonathan Locke wrote:
honestly, your response is too thoughtful. these pointy haired bosses
are
self-serving. they don't care about training costs or developer pain and
they don't really care if their org runs efficiently. what they care
about
is that if there is a failure, their choice didn't cause it. which is
why
the old saying goes "nobody ever got fired for buying IBM." same seems
to
go for struts. an idiotic technology choice, but you won't get fired
for
making the same idiotic choice everyone else is making.
Loritsch, Berin C. wrote:
"But why choose an inferior technology just because of its adoption
numbers?"
The pointy haired bosses that do this believe in their heart of hearts
that if you choose the same technology everyone else is using that they
can turn thinking developers for mindless drones. It has more to do
with avoiding training costs and rational thought, and more to do with
trying to turn software development into an assembly line process.
Reality never fits this mold, but it doesn't stop the pointy haired
boss
from trying. In this respect they are eternal optimists.
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Friday, January 08, 2010 4:09 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Help with Wicket Adoption Numbers
Hi,
We also had the same consideration when we chose Wicket. But why choose
an inferior technology just because of it's Adoption Numbers? Also,
Wicket
is becoming more and more popular as people see the light :)
Check out Jobs Trends (Relative Growth) here (JSF vs Struts vs Wicket):
http://www.indeed.com/jobtrends?q=Struts%2C+JSF%2C+Wicket&l=&relative=1
We have a couple of hundred customers and so far the feedback is great
both from our Developers and our Software Architects. Customers like
that the GUIs are faster due to the simplicity of Ajax Adoption in
Wicket.
I also know that several large privately held companies in Sweden are
using Wicket, as well as large Government Agencies (e.g. the Swedish
Immigration Office).
Sincerely yours
Leo Erlandsson
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