This list was formed to get away from the interminable, meaningless
and unproductive debate between "pathological skeptics" and "true
believers." The list was formed especially to get away from the ego
feeding pathological skeptics on sci.physics.fusion that filled the
bandwidth and prevented meaningful discussion. That specifically
included *you* if I recall correctly. Despite initial appearances,
you haven't changed much in 15 years!
In your false analogy, appended below, you are not the punchbowl. The
turd floating in this punchbowl appears to be you! 8^)
See the vortex-l rules:
http://amasci.com/weird/wvort.html
especially Rule 2, and
http://amasci.com/weird/vmore.html
http://amasci.com/pathskep.html
Quoting Bill Beaty:
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Vortex-L is for those who see great value in removing their usual mental
filters by provisionally accepting the validity of "impossible"
phenomena
in order to test them. This excellent quote found by Gene Mallove
clearly
states the problem, and reveals the need for "true believers" in a
science
community otherwise ruled by conservative scoffers:
"It is really quite amazing by what margins competent but
conservative
scientists and engineers can miss the mark, when they start with the
preconceived idea that what they are investigating is impossible.
When
this happens, the most well-informed men become blinded by their
prejudices and are unable to see what lies directly ahead of them."
- Arthur C. Clarke, 1963
So, on Vortex-L we intentionally suspend the disbelieving attitude of
those who believe in the stereotypical "scientific method." While this
does leave us open to the great personal embarrassment of falling for
hoaxes and delusional thinking, we tolerate this problem in our quest to
consider ideas and phenomena which would otherwise be rejected out of
hand
without a fair hearing. There are diamonds in the filth, and we see
that
we cannot hunt for diamonds without getting dirty.
Note that skepticism of the openminded sort is perfectly acceptable on
Vortex-L. The ban here is aimed at scoffing and "hostile disbelief,"
and
at the sort of "Skeptic" who angrily disbelieves all that is not solidly
proved true, while carefully rejecting all new data and observations
which
conflict with widely accepted theory.
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Here specifically is rule 2:
2. NO SNEERING. Ridicule, derision, scoffing, and ad-hominem is
banned. "Pathological Skepticism" is banned (see the link.) The
tone
here should be one of legitimate disagreement and respectful debate.
Vortex-L is a big nasty nest of 'true believers' (hopefully
having some
tendency to avoid self-deception,) and skeptics may as well leave in
disgust. But if your mind is open and you wish to test "crazy"
claims
rather than ridiculing them or explaining them away, hop on board!
and the link regarding pathological skepticism, once again, is:
http://amasci.com/pathskep.html
On Feb 21, 2011, at 9:29 AM, Rich Murray wrote:
Joshua Cude still impresses me as the only adult in the class in
junior high school -- very impressive clarity of comprehension, speedy
assessment of essential factors, vigorous lucid communication, terse
effortless pointed prose, alert compassion, as he tackles the tedious
task of pointing out to the dubious crowd that the emperor has no
clothes...
Hey, Jed, you Reb, you've got General Grant running you down...
I can hardly believe that anyone still pays any attention at all to
BlackLight Power...
The last famous SPAWAR "triple track" report took pages to end up with
estimates about a single triple spot out of millions...
We can enjoy all this if we treat it as a "reality show", believers
versus skeptics, playing it for laughs, especially at ourselves.
If what's going on is truly infinite, then all apparently finite flows
of perception-thought are always going to fall flat on their faces,
including CM, SR, GR, QM, BB, SS, evolution, linear one-way
causality...
Get used to it...
I learned a lot at MIT when the professors would leap over a gap in
their presentation by waving their hands in the air with a decidedly
sheepish grin...
Rich, the punch bowl that floats the turd...
Best regards,
Horace Heffner
http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
