Re: [WISPA] High Capacity AP alternatives?

[Blair Davis]

I'd like more info on these or similar things as well. I assume they connect to B/G/N CPE?  I don't have to replace all my UBNT CPE? How about the omni antenna plots/patterns?  Maybe a 2.4GHz only version? Pricing? -- On 1/26/2013 8:31 PM, Patrick Leary wrote: Feb 12 there will be a WISPA hosted webinar on the 2450 series. Nothing like VL. No throttling barriers. Indoor CPE sub $50, outdoor CPE sub $150. ...This is not the old Alvarion, though I'm feeling a lot older! Sent from my iPhone On Jan 26, 2013, at 5:36 PM, "Matt Hoppes" <mhop...@indigowireless.com> wrote: So when can more information about these devices be had?  Is the licensing going to be similar to the VL equipment from yester-year?  Or are they wide open and you get what you buy? Sent from my iPad On Jan 26, 2013, at 17:21, Patrick Leary <patrick.le...@alvarion.com> wrote: I actually do not know yet. The 2450 are new and different from the previous ones in terms of some of the hardware (filters and such), so I don't yet have North American anecdotal examples. Most international examples are not WISP-based I understand, using omni versions for apps like smart cities, indoor coverage from outside, stadiums, etc. The WISP market is a big reason why we are doing the sector versions.   The specs on the dual band sector are: 2.4 GHz: HGDP, 12dBi, 120ºH x 16ºV 5 GHz: HGDP, 14dBi, 120ºH x 8ºV   Effective directed EIRP totals are high because they meet the PTP FCC requirements because of the adaptive beamforming: 2.4 GHz: 48 dBm 5 GHz: 49 dBm   Those of you smarter than I can probably do the math then to get an idea of range at various heights. The one example I know from a trusted source (my engineer) is his getting stable 20mbps with the USB device one mile away from his house with the BTS mounted on the railing of his 2nd story porch. I am not sure of his LOS or NLOS condition, but I should assume mostly LOS to be safe. The beamforming is bi-directional from the CPE up as well, so that should help the range too.   Patrick Leary Alvarion 727.501.3735   From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 5:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] High Capacity AP alternatives?   Patrick, Out of curiosity what kind of distance can you get from the tower running 3X3? Sent from my iPad On Jan 26, 2013, at 17:07, Patrick Leary <patrick.le...@alvarion.com> wrote: Thanks for the details Tyson. You are right, that version is the legacy b/g version with 3 omnis diagonally opposed. That has 450 mbps aggregate (obviously in top modulation). The new 2450 series are N-based and feature 6 radios. Both the 2.4 and the 5GHz side are 3x3 MIMO. The versions include:   WBSn 2450-S which is a single dual band sector in 120 degrees with 6 antenna elements. I can get you exact H/V details if you want. WBSn 2450-O which has three diagonally-opposed dual band omnis, again with each band 3x3. WBSn 2450-SO comes with a single 5 GHz 3x3 120 sector and 3 diagonally-opposed 2.4 omnis.   Yes John, we have client devices, among them: Dual Zone Indoor AP. It also beamforms and it is basically a very small form factor repeater that picks up the outdoor signal and re-broadcasts indoor. It is a really effective little box. There is an outdoor CPE as you would expect. There is also a USB version CPE as well as a desk mount.   I have to check as there may be others.   Max associations on BTSs are 512. All deliver 900 mbps aggregate.   They all do beam adaptive beamforming, which means the antennas target all the energy to each client and does this on a per packet decision basis. This helps considerably with interference mitigation. The radios also have several other patented interference mitigation techniques.   Alvarion improved upon the performance of these radios as well and the 2450 series are the result. All are IP68 (complete submersion down to 3 feet deep) boxes and feel like tanks.   Patrick Leary Alvarion 727.501.3735   From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tyson Shreeves Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 3:20 PM To: j...@mvn.net; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] High Capacity AP alternatives?   We have 3 omni wbs2400 deployed currently and our original reason for trying wavion was the amount of clients we wanted to connect to a single ap.  The most we had was 110 clients at one time, but we noticed some performance issues at around 80-90 clients.  The model mentioned is BG only not N.  Clients connected were roughly 2/3 legacy ubiquiti and 1/3 newer ubnt dual mimo on it.  Customers speeds set from 512k to 5Mb.  They use something called beam forming I believe that supposedly just enables it to penetrate or go around obstacles more efficiently and I think for an omni (which I usually hate) it gets a solid 5-7 miles near line of sight.  The new ones they have are BGN and can dual band(2.4 & 5.8) and supposedly can handle double the amount of clients.  And another plus is the few times we have had issues all ive done is create a tech file in the web gui email it and they are good about troubleshooting with you.  If u have specific questions I didn't answer let me know.   Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID John Scrivner <j...@mvn.net> wrote: Could you share details about Wavion? How many customers on an AP? Is it omni or secotor? MIMO? Do they have AP and client devices? Longest customer link? Latency results average/max/min on longest shot? Do they only use plain vanilla Wifi or some scheduled TDMA variant (like UBNT AirMAX or Proxim WARP or old Karlnet stuff)? Max raw TCP throughput per sector? How many deployments? Anything like this would be very valuable. I liked to hearing about all Wavion was supposed to be able to do when I saw them at a show but I am always hesitant to believe anything that is pure Wifi can be a real outdoor delivery platform. Very interested to hear your results about this device. Thank you, Scriv    On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 6:29 AM, Tyson Shreeves <ty...@wigi.us> wrote: We have had good luck with a couple of wavion AP's.  They can b a little pricey though.   Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID Josh Luthman <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote: Huawei?  Canadian WISP is doing 3.5 GHz with their stuff. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Jan 26, 2013 12:31 AM, "Mike Hammett" <wispawirel...@ics-il.net> wrote: There's Cambium, WiFi, LTE and WiMAX that I can think of. Alvarion has recently come out with a higher capacity AP (LTE?), but I'd consider it to be at the new bar for average. Otherwise, WiMAX and LTE are generally too low of throughput to be useful. I don't think anyone has really enough of a differentiator in the WiFi space to not use UBNT or Mikrotik. UBNT is cheap and generally works. Mikrotik has their whole RouterOS behind it and generally works. Cambium is the only thing I can think of that's doing their own thing. It looks really good if only the APs were 90% less expensive. 100 meg of throughput on an AP is really the minimum to be considered. I have areas where I could put something multiples higher to use. ----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matt Jenkins" <m...@smarterbroadband.net> To: us...@wug.cc, "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2013 5:36:26 PM Subject: [WISPA] High Capacity AP alternatives? Besides Cambium, Mikrotik, Ubnt and other WiFi products, is anyone successfully deploying something else to service both residential and business customers? Thanks, - Matt _______________________________________________ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless _______________________________________________ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless _______________________________________________ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless   ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(100). ************************************************************************************ ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(42). ************************************************************************************ ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(42). ************************************************************************************ _______________________________________________ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(100). ************************************************************************************ ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(42). ************************************************************************************ ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(42). ************************************************************************************ _______________________________________________ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(100). ************************************************************************************ ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(42). ************************************************************************************ _______________________________________________ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(100). ************************************************************************************ ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(42). ************************************************************************************ ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(42). ************************************************************************************ _______________________________________________ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- West Michigan Wireless ISP Allegan, Michigan 49010 269-686-8648 A Division of: Camp Communication Services, INC

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