Too many benefits to virtualizing your routing infrastructure to list here. Its where things are going in the future. For me, its centralized management, backups, redundancy, flexibility. Also if you need more horsepower than a 1072 you can scale what you need pretty fast. You can clone or replicate entire boxes pretty quick. You can create templates to spin up new routers all with every config you need. I know its as easy as copying a config file over.
That being said it really makes no sense to do this for under 10Gbps of traffic. I've always used hot spares. But consider this. A router is giving your issues locks you out, stops passing traffic etc. You need to go to the location or use some remote serial login like an open gear to try and determine whats wrong. You physically need to replace the hardware or switch plugs, copy configs. On a VM you can access it remotely and restore from backup in a couple minutes, even have it automatically failover to other hosts, or have its resources expanded as needed. From the comfort of your underwear at home... :) -- Steven Kenney Network Operations Manager WaveDirect Telecommunications http://www.wavedirect.net (519)737-WAVE (9283) From: "Josh Baird" <joshba...@gmail.com> To: "af" <af@af.afmug.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2020 7:50:34 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out Virtualization of core network. I can run a number of MT CHR's on a single box (and with redundancy at both the hypervisor layer and L3). For example, I have a pair of vSphere boxes each with a CHR for customer aggregation, one for a BGP route reflector and another doing some other misc stuff. These boxes have 4-6 10Gbps interfaces that I can share between all of the CHR VM's. Driver development is also on CHR, not on MIkrotik X86. On Wed, May 20, 2020 at 6:17 PM Nate Burke < [ mailto:n...@blastcomm.com | n...@blastcomm.com ] > wrote: So Obviously I haven't had the need to run CHR, but I'm trying to figure out why you need it. Why bother to put Mikrotik in a VM instead of dedicated hardware? I'm not being difficult, I'm just trying to understand why this is a thing. Specifically for routing to hosts inside a VM Architecture, or are you virtualizing your core network routing. On 5/20/2020 4:31 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: BQ_BEGIN That's what I was thinking... I could see doing snapshots if you were using CHR on a more advanced VM setup, but I can't imagine why you'd bother with that on something like the Maxxwave that we're talking about here. On Wed, May 20, 2020 at 2:07 PM Mark - Myakka Technologies < [ mailto:m...@mailmt.com | m...@mailmt.com ] > wrote: BQ_BEGIN Josh, Why is this an issue? I'm working on a CHR VMWARE test box now. What is the purpose of the snapshot? Why not just use the backup/export features of mikrotik for your backup? Won't you have a generic VM/CHR router siting on the shelf ready to go as backup. Fire it up and reload the configuration with the mikrotik tools. That is what I'm doing now with my routerboards.  -- Best regards, Mark               [ mailto:m...@mailmt.com ] [ mailto:m...@mailmt.com | mailto:m...@mailmt.com ] Myakka Technologies, Inc. [ http://www.myakka.com/ | www.Myakka.com ] ------ Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 2:29:04 PM, you wrote: Depends on your backup tool. I'm using ghettoVCB and it would definitely be an interruption - really bad for stateful things. Keep in mind you're only backing up a vmdisk with maybe 128 megabytes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Wed, May 20, 2020 at 9:55 AM Steven Kenney < [ mailto:st...@wavedirect.org ] [ mailto:st...@wavedirect.org | st...@wavedirect.org ] > wrote: Most backup tools are agnostic. They use Vmwares' functions to do the backups and the vmware tools to either quiesce the file system, create deltas etc. The process in how it is done is similar across all platforms, Veeam Acronis, Nakivo etc. The performance is dependent on how well the hardware performs. For example I have one server that isn't very large on the same host as a server that is a massive moving target (non stop writing/reading). One will backup much faster than the other depending on the storage capabilities, network capabilities .. overall the hardware capabilities. If I moved both servers to a new host with better hardware, faster network,  the backups times and performance would increase on both. To the point where possibly there is no disruption for either server. The question is whether or not people have done virtual backups on CHR's without disruptions, specifically on this Maxxwave.  HA (high availability) has nothing to do with this scenario. The CHR would have to be non responsive for quite a long time without any other processes still taking place to it (the entire backup process would have had to have crashed). For me HA only works if a server is down on 1 host, it'll bring it up on another host. It won't bring up copies of VM's if a backup is taking a while.  If any backup takes that long I'd never use it as a router.  Now there is proactive HA - but that is a recipe for disaster when running routers. DRS as well is part of that equation and I wouldn't recommend that either for a router. It could possibly be a switching nightmare unless you have the higher end vsphere setup with vswitches and virtual networking. I'm just running standard Vsphere.  I think though Mikrotik CHR's are pretty lightweight compared to some servers. Most can be contained in memory with little disk IO so snapshots and commits will be quick. The question was if any customers use the Maxxwave and how it performs with backups/snapshots. Also I reviewed the spec sheet and it does show support for larger than 10Gbps.  -- Steven Kenney Network Operations Manager WaveDirect Telecommunications [ http://www.wavedirect.net/ | http://www.wavedirect.net ] (519)737-WAVE (9283) From: "Josh Luthman" < [ mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com ] [ mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com | j...@imaginenetworksllc.com ] > To: "af" < [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | af@af.afmug.com ] > Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2020 9:22:04 AM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out Your backup lag/performance is your backup tool. If you do a snapshot and copy, that will mostly halt your system until it can set aside a temporary disk. If you do HA it won't cause any delay. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Wed, May 20, 2020 at 8:51 AM Steven Kenney < [ mailto:st...@wavedirect.org ] [ mailto:st...@wavedirect.org | st...@wavedirect.org ] > wrote: I remember seeing these several years ago. Anyone know if they have support coming for faster than 10Gbps? Anyone run these in an actual vsphere environment? How are snapshots and backups for it? Any lag or performance hits during the process?  -- Steven Kenney Network Operations Manager WaveDirect Telecommunications [ http://www.wavedirect.net/ | http://www.wavedirect.net ] (519)737-WAVE (9283) From: "Kurt Fankhauser" < [ mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com ] [ mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com | lists.wavel...@gmail.com ] > To: "af" < [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | af@af.afmug.com ] > Sent: Friday, May 15, 2020 11:02:28 AM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out Baltic does not have any native x86 Mikrotik Router. They are using CHR on the Maxxwave Vengence appliance, which works remarkably well. On Wed, May 13, 2020 at 9:52 AM Josh Luthman < [ mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com ] [ mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com | j...@imaginenetworksllc.com ] > wrote: Baltic seems to be the go to for x86 Mikrotik. He seems to always be on top of it. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Tue, May 12, 2020 at 3:13 PM Kurt Fankhauser < [ mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com ] [ mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com | lists.wavel...@gmail.com ] > wrote: I will second the Baltic Networks Vengence 2 CHR. Has been nothing but totally reliable since we got one in January. Only pushing about 1.5gbps through it though, but BGP converge times are insanely fast and it was darn near the same cost as a CCR1072. On Tue, May 12, 2020 at 12:25 PM James Howard < [ mailto:ja...@litewire.net ] [ mailto:ja...@litewire.net | ja...@litewire.net ] > wrote: Yeah, there seems to be is the key……  I did that with the last one and had some compatibility issues with the SFP+ cards and didn’t really end up saving any money over buying one already put together.  From: AF [mailto: [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com | af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] ] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 11:13 AM To: [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | af@af.afmug.com ] Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out I'd imagine you can source a pretty burly network appliance PC from somewhere. There seem to be dozens of options. On 5/12/2020 11:57 AM, James Howard wrote: Baltic says they aren’t sure when they’re going to get the Maxxwave in again. We have one of the Maxxwave i7s and would just get more if they were available. I was hoping Dennis would reply. They don’t seem to list the PowerRouter that they used to sell on their site anymore. From: AF [ [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com | mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] ] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 10:45 AM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | <af@af.afmug.com> ] Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out Baltic/Maxxwave has one, but their web store shows out of stock, is it actually discontinued? Linktechs might have one, if you don’t want to build your own. From: AF < [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com | af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] > On Behalf Of James Howard Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 10:17 AM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' < [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | af@af.afmug.com ] > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out So what is awesome and available now? We had an i7 box (network appliance I guess) running Mikrotik take a dump so we need to get another backup (or two). Nobody seems to have i7 based Mikrotik boxes available. BGP is a must. We’re running CHR on our current boxes. From: AF [ [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com | mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] ] On Behalf Of Dennis Burgess via AF Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 9:51 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | af@af.afmug.com ] > Cc: Dennis Burgess < [ mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net ] [ mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net | dmburg...@linktechs.net ] > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out I would not expect it to be "AWSOME" till v7.... Dennis Burgess Mikrotik : Trainer, Network Associate, Routing Engineer, Wireless Engineer, Traffic Control Engineer, Inter-Networking Engineer, Security Engineer, Enterprise Wireless Engineer Hurricane Electric: IPv6 Sage Level Cambium: ePMP Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition" Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services Office: 314-735-0270  Website: [ http://www.linktechs.net/ ] [ http://www.linktechs.net/ | http://www.linktechs.net ] Create Wireless Coverage's with [ http://www.towercoverage.com/ ] [ http://www.towercoverage.com/ | www.towercoverage.com ] -----Original Message----- From: AF < [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com%3e ] [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com | af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] > On Behalf Of [ mailto:fiber...@mail.com | fiber...@mail.com ] Sent: Monday, May 11, 2020 11:51 PM To: [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | af@af.afmug.com ] Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out Surprisingly bad BGP results from the CCR2004 [ https://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=161044 ] [ https://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=161044 | https://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=161044 ] -- AF mailing list [ mailto:AF@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:AF@af.afmug.com | AF@af.afmug.com ] [ http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com ] [ http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com | http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com ] -- AF mailing list [ mailto:AF@af.afmug.com ] [ mailto:AF@af.afmug.com | AF@af.afmug.com ] [ http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com ] [ http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com | http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com ] Total Control Panel [ https://asp.reflexion.net/login?domain=litewire.net | Login ] To: [ https://asp.reflexion.net/address-properties?aID=242260993&domain=litewire.net | ja...@litewire.net ] From: [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com | af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] You received this message because the domain [ http://afmug.com/ | afmug.com ] is on your allow list. 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