Maybe *shrug*
Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Mon, Apr 24, 2017 at 12:29 PM, Adam Moffett <dmmoff...@gmail.com> wrote: > I thought it was "hire fast and fire faster" > > > ------ Original Message ------ > From: "Josh Luthman" <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> > To: "af@afmug.com" <af@afmug.com> > Sent: 4/24/2017 11:55:13 AM > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] installer hire / training process. > > "First fast, hire slow" -Travis Johnson > > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340> > Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343> > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > On Mon, Apr 24, 2017 at 11:23 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: > >> At my peak, I had almost exactly 100 employees with half of them >> installers. We had new guys ride along with the more seasoned veterans for >> two weeks. If their trainer gave us a thumbs up, they got a truck and were >> turned loose. If the trainer said thumbs down, we gave them two more weeks >> and then they were let go if they did not turn it around. You cannot let >> it drag on. Cut them lose and move on. I never had regrets after firing >> anyone other than “should have done that about 3 years ago”. >> >> *From:* Ben Royer >> *Sent:* Monday, April 24, 2017 9:17 AM >> *To:* af@afmug.com >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] installer hire / training process. >> >> It’s interesting reading responses, definitely two different cultures. I >> was raised in the midst of both really, luckily I stuck to the former, not >> the current, and therefor to me hustle makes sense. It’s about having a >> sense of pride for yourself and your work. I can definitely see the >> division amongst my team though, as I have young and old, from all >> different backgrounds. I have a team of 6 installers, with an 7th that is >> my senior employee that I’ve recently transitioned to ‘Lead Tech’. He’s a >> bit of a facilitator, someone I can rely on to train new hires, audit >> installs, fix major issues, etc. I’ve dealt with most issues mentioned, >> I’ve got the guys that fly through jobs, can do 7 a day, but the quality >> lacks. Then I’ve got the guys that might take 4 or 5 hours, but their >> installs are impeccable. The main reason I started the ‘Lead Tech’ role, >> was to find a happy medium to all the different methods, so that at the end >> of the day, the customer is satisfied for many years to come. I think >> that’s my major takeaway, is regardless of how long it takes, aside from >> obvious economics, as long as the job is a quality job and the customer is >> satisfied, it’s a job well done. >> >> As far as training new hires. We have always done that through osmosis. >> We spend the first few days in the classroom, giving a basic orientation of >> who we are, and what are system is like. I give some RF training, so they >> understand it’s not magic, it’s not a laser, there is science behind the >> actual physical structure of RF. Then I pair them up with a senior tech, >> now the Lead Tech, and send them on their way. They spend the first 30-60 >> days of their 90 days with that tech, learning efficient ways to install, >> and slowly taking on tasks as the Lead tech assigns. Eventually, working >> into a role of doing the whole job while the Lead follows. During this >> time frame we have break out sessions as needed. Early on I do a break out >> session on tower safety, and we do follow up meetings with them and the >> Lead tech to see how they are progressing, and I tweak their training as >> needed to address concerns or short comings. Usually, by 40 days or so, >> they are ready to do jobs, but no later than 60 days, and then we turn them >> lose to try it on their own. You will always have call ins for help, >> expect that, and they will be slow on their own at first, but I find the >> key is empowering them to make decisions. Most of my slower guys are slow >> because they second, or triple, guess their work, instead of just making a >> decision and moving on. I had one guy that was told to test 5 different >> tours by dispatch to ‘find a signal’, he thought that meant test all of >> them, even though he found a signal on the first one he tested, so I had to >> explain the goal is to get a signal, period, it’s inefficient to test all >> towers, Dispatch was just telling you that you have 5 options. >> >> If you have an employee that is just too slow and not catching on, it’s >> time to let them go, I’ve had to do that also. Some people just are not >> cut out for this type of work, as it is a unique job of physical labor, >> mixed with a level of intelligence when it comes to the technical side of >> things. Military guys are GREAT installer hires, some of my best employees >> are former military. Everything can be trained, but hiring someone that >> has the will power and determination to work hard, and is respectful, is a >> huge advantage to that process. I didn’t really see where you discussed >> the exact findings that was causing your employee to be slow, but I’m sure >> once you start to identify them, focusing some attention on those areas >> will quickly teach you on if they can adapt, or need to be let go. >> >> Thank you, >> Ben Royer, Operations Manager >> Royell Communications, Inc. >> 217-965-3699 <(217)%20965-3699> www.royell.net >> >> *From:* Chuck McCown >> *Sent:* Monday, April 24, 2017 9:31 AM >> *To:* af@afmug.com >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] installer hire / training process. >> >> Not saying to rush for the sake of rushing, saying to go fast. Do things >> perfectly in the least amount of time possible. That means hustle. Why >> would you chose to slowly drag your ass between the truck and the house? >> There is absolutely no justification for not jogging back and forth. Not >> saying to sprint or full on run. Just jog, show some hustle. Economy of >> movements. That includes tool and supply organization. >> >> At the end of the day it is now many perfect installs you do a day. If >> you get more than the other guy and you drag your ass, I would not can you, >> probably give you a raise. >> >> But if you were dragging your ass, leaving the shop late, BSing instead >> of working I would tell you to ‘hustle” one time... >> >> *From:* Josh Reynolds >> *Sent:* Monday, April 24, 2017 8:24 AM >> *To:* af@afmug.com >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] installer hire / training process. >> >> To tell the truth, I'd be telling you to fuck off as well. >> >> Having an employee run is a liability for several reasons. Rushing leads >> to forgotten things and shoddy work, and tying installs to pay with cause >> you to end up with the install quality that DirecTV subcontractors do, as >> they get paid per room/job as well. It's absolutely shit work that looks >> bad and often has problems you will have to roll a truck for. >> >> Slow and smooth, measured work, thought out in advance with no wasted >> efficiency. THAT will be fast and quality work. >> >> "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast." >> >> In the end, it's your business. I'm just some guy. >> >> - Josh >> >> On Apr 24, 2017 8:57 AM, "Chuck McCown" <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: >> >> Well then you would not be working for me. Or UPS or FedEX or Les Schwab >> or Tunex or ...... >> >> Treating someone like crap is a far different thing than treating them >> like an adult. You own their work output when they are on the clock and >> they need to work efficiently. >> >> It is not unreasonable at all to expect some hustle. I don’t pay anyone >> to take their time. >> >> *From:* Timothy Steele >> *Sent:* Monday, April 24, 2017 7:53 AM >> *To:* af@afmug.com >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] installer hire / training process. >> >> >> If you treat your employees like crap like that there going to start >> looking for a new boss I know if I was walking to the house and you told me >> to run I would quit on the spot if that's what you want then go for it >> >> On Mon, Apr 24, 2017, 9:43 AM Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: >> >>> You cannot expect a younger person to run for any reason until they >>> decide that it might benefit them, and even them real hustle will be rare. >>> >>> I would put them on piece rate or daily rate and tell them they have to >>> do at least 3 per day to keep their job. Once they are doing 3, then up it >>> to 4 or keep them on piece rate. >>> >>> Have you actually said “RUN!” when they were walking from truck to >>> house? Have them watch the first half of full metal jacket and give them a >>> bit of drill sergeant treatment. >>> >>> I believe in “management by telling” you actually have to tell them, in >>> simple and clear terms exactly what you want. >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* Brandon Yuchasz >>> *Sent:* Sunday, April 23, 2017 5:37 PM >>> *To:* af@afmug.com >>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] installer hire / training process. >>> >>> I was going to type a long PC type post about this (which I did anyway >>> sorry) . But instead I am going to just ask how you guys go about trying to >>> teach / train a new installer to work faster? >>> >>> >>> >>> We have a guy right now that was hired to be an installer with other >>> duties as assigned. He is good at the other duties and has a good >>> understanding of networking, computers and even RF. The problem is that he >>> is very slow on installs and the primary job he was hired to do. >>> >>> >>> >>> I spent quite a bit of time with him last week trying to figure out >>> where the speed issues were coming from. So I took him on site surveys >>> ahead of time with me and we laid out the entire installs during the >>> survey. Install here, wire down here, across here in through wall here and >>> terminate. You could see the tower from these sites so hanging and tuning >>> the radio was a breeze. >>> >>> >>> >>> I sent him out on two installs the day after that. First one I >>> considered a hard install. The second one easy. They took him over 10 >>> hours not counting drive time. >>> >>> >>> >>> I spent the next morning doing site checks on them with the customers >>> permission. Both customers were happy with him and his install and not a >>> single thing on the install was done incorrectly I took another installer >>> with me and asked him to run the time frame in his head. He came up to 3 >>> hours for each install. So had I but we are both experienced. >>> >>> >>> >>> So I talked really briefly with the new guy about getting faster and >>> then took him to an install I had surveyed myself. Ran him through the >>> entire install. Radio here, wire down here….. in and terminate. Install >>> router. I left the more experienced guy with him to answer questions but >>> told him to not physically help and explained to the new guy that if he had >>> questions to ask because the other guy is there to help him figure out a >>> faster process and would be talking with me after the install about ways >>> to speed up the process so we can help him. I should mention the >>> experienced guy is a supervisor so no hard feelings should be had here. I >>> left him at 9:00 >>> >>> >>> >>> I was thinking that maybe I was being unrealistic in my time frames on >>> installs since normally I have a helper on my installs and we knock out >>> three to four a day. I felt like I got my installs done in 3 hours max when >>> I was alone but never really timed them. So when I left the new guy I drove >>> a half hour to what I considered a hard install and did it alone. Was done >>> at 12:30 and driving back to check on the new guy. When I got there he was >>> just about done with the install but the truck was spread around the >>> driveway ( not throwing stones I have been known to do this). So he was >>> going past hour 4 at this point with paperwork and packing the truck he was >>> going to be at 5 for sure. I stepped in did the paperwork and quietly >>> asked the other guy to pack up the truck some. This was done for selfish >>> reasons ( its Friday and I have a family) and also because we had a >>> between 1 and 3 to hit for the final install of the day. >>> >>> >>> >>> Grabbed subway. Scoffed it down. I bought and we headed to the last job. >>> >>> >>> >>> I had the supervisor guy in my truck and we have worked together a lot >>> 100s of installs together. So on the way to the install which he had never >>> seen I prep him on it. Big ladder ( 32”) up on the gable on the back of the >>> house. Take the little giant around to the deck so I can access the roof. >>> And it’s a tripod install. So when we pull into the drive I point to the >>> back of the house “that’s the back” he says okay and I go to ring the >>> doorbell and say hello. He has the new guy with him so he told him to help >>> with the ladder and then instructed him to start an rj45 on a wire. When I >>> walked out the ladder was up and the supervisor was at the top screwing >>> down the tripod. I grabbed the mast, mounted the antenna and put the >>> wireless unit on it to tune and scurried up the small ladder and up the >>> roof. Ill make this short. We hung the gear and tuned and marked the tripod >>> and I went down and he had just finished the RJ45. In his defense he had >>> put one on a 3 foot scrap piece that he had confused with the rest of the >>> wire in the box( I don’t know) so this was his second end. Anyway we just >>> ran the job and he stayed out of the way. This was a hard roof, tall and >>> not LOS and we were done in the truck heading home in just under two hours. >>> But that was two guys and we ran. >>> >>> >>> >>> Ok so this is getting long sorry about that but I just am at a loss with >>> this guy. I did realize on that last job I run on job sites. I always run >>> to the truck back from the truck and I think ahead. This guy defiantly does >>> not run and nothing is done with any sense of urgency. He is certainly >>> smart and I hate to let him go because he has other values but I don’t know >>> what I can do to help him. He was hired to take the load off of me and I >>> realize at the beginning new guys are work but its been over two months now >>> he just recently took on jobs alone and he is not taking the load off. He >>> is adding to it. >>> >>> >>> >>> Thoughts? >>> >>> >>> >>> Is to wrong to say, your slow I don’t know why but I am going to fire >>> you if you don’t get fast. I wish I could tell you how to get fast but Its >>> lots of little things. Start with running everywhere you go and see if that >>> helps? >>> >>> >>> >>> Seriously…. I do want to know from those of you that have hired lots of >>> guys what are your thoughts? Should I not be running one man crews with the >>> expectation of two installs in an 8 hour day with an hour of drive time in >>> there? >>> >>> >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > >
