Re: [AFMUG] Dc plant conversion

[George Skorup]

That current though. I'm looking at doing a rack mount cabinet and telco 
rectifier at medium and large sites going forward. It just makes sense. 
What really sucks is when a small site turns into a medium site and then 
there's not enough cabinet space. So I'm gathering some ideas and costs 
to just do the same thing at every site. Everything except the really 
small sites where we might have something like an ePMP omni and a 
handful of customers. Which is yet another problem. Might as well use an 
ePMP 2k lite, which is 48vdc. And then backhaul it on a Force200 or 
450SM, which is obviously 24vdc. Ugh. Most of the time we just say screw 
it and throw in a small APC UPS, a switch and POE bricks. Perhaps that's 
somewhere something like a small Netonix switch with internal DC-DC 
converters would be useful. Until the on-board GPS goes to shit and you 
have no sync. It's never ending round and round WTF do I do for these.

On 1/29/2018 9:29 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
There's a lot to like about that setup.  The DR-UPS can do 40amp on 
24v, so your upper limit is almost 1kW.  Just drive it with a bigger 
24v supply as needed.

What has held me back from that in the past is the DR-UPS is not 
available in 48v, and the biggest power consumers I have are 48V.  I 
went to Traco to stay 48V.  OTOH your rig is so much cheaper than 
Traco that adding an RSD-300B-48 for another $100 is not a bad deal.


------ Original Message ------
From: "David Coudron" <david.coud...@advantenon.com 
<mailto:david.coud...@advantenon.com>>
To: "af@afmug.com" <af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Sent: 1/28/2018 10:39:56 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Dc plant conversion

Here is what we are doing, I think this is close to what Steve is 
asking for:

Meanwell SDR-240-24 AC to DC power source:  $84

Meanwell DR-UPS40 Battery Float/UPS: $37

Tycon TPDIN MonitorWeb2:  $131

24 V of battery backup $70-120 depending on the runtime looking for

Netonix 150 W or 250 DC switch: $250-350  (This is really the only 
expensive component)

Heater:   $65

Fan:  $14

With this, we can run 5-8 hours on very small batteries, we figure we 
have several hours to get a generator to the site if power isn’t 
coming back.   We run all POE from the Netonix, it works really 
well.   Here are the other things we can do with the box:

 1. Monitor temp in the cabinet
 2. Monitor/alert on loss of AC line power through TP DIN
 3. Monitor voltage of the batteries
 4. Monitor voltage to the Netonix
 5. Monitor Current to the Netonix
 6. Monitor Current in/out of the batteries
 7. Auto start the heater below 40 degrees
 8. Auto start the fan above 80 degrees
 9. Power cycle the netonix from the TP DIN
10. Power cycle any AP, Router, Backhaul from the Netonix

We also put a Mikrotik router in this cabinet.   Usually a Hex POE 
(for small sites) or a 3011 for larger sites.

We have 13 in the field set up like this and are going 15 more right 
now.   While it might be a little more than what you were thinking, 
it gives us a ton of control for pretty minimal investment per site.

Best part is, no coding necessary. Doing all this with the Monitor 
Web2 settings and/or SNMP.    Let me know if you are interested in 
pictures. For this second batch we have started using Terminal blocks 
to clean up the wiring, the cabinets look a little better, but we 
went to a smaller poly cabinet that makes things a little tight.

Regards,

David Coudron

*From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com 
<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] *On Behalf Of *Carl Peterson
*Sent:* Saturday, January 27, 2018 5:39 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Dc plant conversion

You can still do DC-DC off it and then hook up netonix.  If I had to 
do it now I'd go with the IDC switch.  When we did our design, the 
idc didn't exist so we just went down to 24V off of our A  and B 
sides and run a redundant powered 24V bus which all the netonix 
switches run on.

I better buy up another batch of Elteks before all y'all buy them all 
up. These are mostly decommissioned Sprint/Clearwire btw.


On Jan 27, 2018, at 1:02 PM, Josh Baird <joshba...@gmail.com 
<mailto:joshba...@gmail.com>> wrote:

    A 12 port version would be nice. Looks like the 26 port version
    is $600.

    On Sat, Jan 27, 2018 at 12:59 PM, Gino A. Villarini
    <g...@aeronetpr.com <mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>> wrote:

        Used to, now with the IDC model is not needed (isolated dc)…

        *From: *Af <af-boun...@afmug.com
        <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>> on behalf of Josh Baird
        <joshba...@gmail.com <mailto:joshba...@gmail.com>>
        *Reply-To: *"af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>"
        <af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>>
        *Date: *Saturday, January 27, 2018 at 1:51 PM
        *To: *"af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>" <af@afmug.com
        <mailto:af@afmug.com>>
        *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Dc plant conversion

        Which Netonix are you running at - 48V?  Or are you using an
        isolated DC/DC converter in between the -48V rectifier and
        Netonix?

        On Sat, Jan 27, 2018 at 12:49 PM, Gino A. Villarini
        <g...@aeronetpr.com <mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>> wrote:

            Refurb/ used Eltek/Valere –48 Rectifier shelf off Ebay
             ~$400 + 1 Netonix IDC Switch $400… all done. You can
            power 90% of WISP gear

            *From: *Af <af-boun...@afmug.com
            <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>> on behalf of Steve Jones
            <thatoneguyst...@gmail.com
            <mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>>
            *Reply-To: *"af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>"
            <af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>>
            *Date: *Friday, January 26, 2018 at 9:49 PM
            *To: *"af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>" <af@afmug.com
            <mailto:af@afmug.com>>
            *Subject: *[AFMUG] Dc plant conversion

            Any of you folks who know both dc plant and even more
            know small wisp budget interested in looking at our gear
            and power setup and giving realistic advice that doesnt
            have a 10 different 500 dollar components combined with a
            full time linux guy and a full time coder?

            Id love you to do it out of the kindness of your heart,
            but i do have some advisory busget.

            Im just tired of the apc ups waste and super ghetto
            runtimes on batteries coupled with having to accept we
            are destroying runtimes by letting the apcs die.....
            please, somebody, please. Otherwise i have to go to the
            facebook groups, and thats like going to a mikrotik or
            ubnt forum.