Serves me right to open my mouth. Sorry won't happen again. -- dims
On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 6:54 AM, Paul Fremantle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Ah the glory days when you were Veep! > > Paul > > On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 10:49 AM, Davanum Srinivas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> related note - i once upon a time used to hold ws up as the best model >> of working in open source. It's a tragic pity that we are now just a >> shell of what we used to be. my 2 cents. YMMV. >> >> -- dims >> >> On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 6:11 AM, Davanum Srinivas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> Samisa, >>> >>> You have hit the nail on the head. People are who they are. Right now >>> the umbrella is so vast that everyone is able to hide behind others. >>> There is no accountability. When there is a smaller group of active >>> people, There will be better accountability to each other and to the >>> board and to our end users. >>> >>> There are tactics that we can employ for example, we should make a new >>> single release including all projects including XmlSchema, Rampart and >>> Sandesha with Axis2. But still make extra releases of say Sandesha2 as >>> necessary as well separately for Sandesha. You will ask, why can't we >>> do this today and i'll say that these kind of tactics work better with >>> a TLP like focus. >>> >>> thanks, >>> dims >>> >>> On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 4:28 AM, Samisa Abeysinghe >>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>>> Davanum Srinivas wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Eran, >>>>> >>>>> Clearly you did not read my previous emails. *PLEASE* read them and >>>>> then we can continue. >>>>> >>>>> For example, I said "1. The proposal was to split Axis2+Anything that >>>>> Axis2 Uses+Anything that is built on Axis2 into a separate TLP." >>>>> >>>>> Also, i said this before, but repeat it again, The current status quo >>>>> sucks. What we have is not working. >>>>> - Really bad web sites >>>>> - Really bad status of JIRA issues >>>>> - Really bad track record of making releases periodically >>>>> - There are many disjoint islands >>>>> - The set of projects mentioned above is totally disjoint from other >>>>> projects in WS PMC. >>>>> >>>> >>>> How can a TLP solve all these? If people are who they are now, even after >>>> making Axis2 a TLP, the bad websites and bad release cycles will remain. >>>> On the other hand, if we cannot sync the releases of Axis2's sub projects, >>>> then irrespective of Axis2 being a TLP, it would turn out to be a useless >>>> project. Because one of Axis2's key strenghts is the set of sub projects it >>>> has. >>>> >>>> So IMHO, what is more important is to solve the above problems. However, I >>>> doubt if TLP would be a solution for that. >>>> >>>> Samisa... >>>>> >>>>> What we have is broken, We are not the only ones in this situation, >>>>> this has happened before at Apache with XML and Jakarta PMC's. Please >>>>> go and look at the history and how the projects are faring now after >>>>> becoming logical/smaller footprint PMCs. Please go ask them or ask the >>>>> board@ or ask members if you don't believe, let's learn from their >>>>> experiences. >>>>> >>>>> *IF* people who are on the current projects that are not in the " >>>>> Axis2+Anything that Axis2 Uses+Anything that is built on Axis2" list >>>>> want to tell us something, they should chime in and tell us what they >>>>> think and we'll take a vote. >>>>> >>>>> Right now it's just a few of us who are just repeating the same things >>>>> over and over again without even reading what the other person is >>>>> saying. >>>>> >>>>> thanks, >>>>> dims >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:07 PM, Eran Chinthaka >>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 5:42 PM, Davanum Srinivas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Chinthaka, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What are the problems that will be created? Please enumerate them. How >>>>>>> is it being handled / smoothed over now and what would change >>>>>>> specifically to make the cooperation not happen. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Problems : >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. Another member will have to waste time on doing PMC work >>>>>> 2. We will lose the tight dependency between Axis2 and related projects >>>>>> like >>>>>> Axiom, Neethi, Sandesha, etc., >>>>>> >>>>>> There are numerous things like this that will happen. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If you can point your finger to specific scenarios. We can see if we >>>>>>> can come up with specific solutions. (Say common svn area where both >>>>>>> committers can have access). >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Let me back up. What is broken in the current layout that mandates us to >>>>>> go >>>>>> for different TLPs? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Also, Don't mind me, i repeat my mantra for the n-th time again. Those >>>>>>> who are actively working on a day to day basis should be taking the >>>>>>> decisions. What we are doing is not working and i propose we try >>>>>>> something new to see if it will work. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> My point is exactly this. Why do we waste time on going to fix something >>>>>> which is not broken? Let's get back to work ;) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Samisa Abeysinghe >>>> >>>> http://people.apache.org/~samisa/ >>>> >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Davanum Srinivas :: http://davanum.wordpress.com >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Davanum Srinivas :: http://davanum.wordpress.com >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> > > > > -- > Paul Fremantle > Co-Founder and CTO, WSO2 > Apache Synapse PMC Chair > OASIS WS-RX TC Co-chair > > blog: http://pzf.fremantle.org > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > "Oxygenating the Web Service Platform", www.wso2.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Davanum Srinivas :: http://davanum.wordpress.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
