related note - i once upon a time used to hold ws up as the best model of working in open source. It's a tragic pity that we are now just a shell of what we used to be. my 2 cents. YMMV.
-- dims On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 6:11 AM, Davanum Srinivas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Samisa, > > You have hit the nail on the head. People are who they are. Right now > the umbrella is so vast that everyone is able to hide behind others. > There is no accountability. When there is a smaller group of active > people, There will be better accountability to each other and to the > board and to our end users. > > There are tactics that we can employ for example, we should make a new > single release including all projects including XmlSchema, Rampart and > Sandesha with Axis2. But still make extra releases of say Sandesha2 as > necessary as well separately for Sandesha. You will ask, why can't we > do this today and i'll say that these kind of tactics work better with > a TLP like focus. > > thanks, > dims > > On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 4:28 AM, Samisa Abeysinghe > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Davanum Srinivas wrote: >>> >>> Eran, >>> >>> Clearly you did not read my previous emails. *PLEASE* read them and >>> then we can continue. >>> >>> For example, I said "1. The proposal was to split Axis2+Anything that >>> Axis2 Uses+Anything that is built on Axis2 into a separate TLP." >>> >>> Also, i said this before, but repeat it again, The current status quo >>> sucks. What we have is not working. >>> - Really bad web sites >>> - Really bad status of JIRA issues >>> - Really bad track record of making releases periodically >>> - There are many disjoint islands >>> - The set of projects mentioned above is totally disjoint from other >>> projects in WS PMC. >>> >> >> How can a TLP solve all these? If people are who they are now, even after >> making Axis2 a TLP, the bad websites and bad release cycles will remain. >> On the other hand, if we cannot sync the releases of Axis2's sub projects, >> then irrespective of Axis2 being a TLP, it would turn out to be a useless >> project. Because one of Axis2's key strenghts is the set of sub projects it >> has. >> >> So IMHO, what is more important is to solve the above problems. However, I >> doubt if TLP would be a solution for that. >> >> Samisa... >>> >>> What we have is broken, We are not the only ones in this situation, >>> this has happened before at Apache with XML and Jakarta PMC's. Please >>> go and look at the history and how the projects are faring now after >>> becoming logical/smaller footprint PMCs. Please go ask them or ask the >>> board@ or ask members if you don't believe, let's learn from their >>> experiences. >>> >>> *IF* people who are on the current projects that are not in the " >>> Axis2+Anything that Axis2 Uses+Anything that is built on Axis2" list >>> want to tell us something, they should chime in and tell us what they >>> think and we'll take a vote. >>> >>> Right now it's just a few of us who are just repeating the same things >>> over and over again without even reading what the other person is >>> saying. >>> >>> thanks, >>> dims >>> >>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:07 PM, Eran Chinthaka >>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 5:42 PM, Davanum Srinivas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Chinthaka, >>>>> >>>>> What are the problems that will be created? Please enumerate them. How >>>>> is it being handled / smoothed over now and what would change >>>>> specifically to make the cooperation not happen. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Problems : >>>> >>>> 1. Another member will have to waste time on doing PMC work >>>> 2. We will lose the tight dependency between Axis2 and related projects >>>> like >>>> Axiom, Neethi, Sandesha, etc., >>>> >>>> There are numerous things like this that will happen. >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> If you can point your finger to specific scenarios. We can see if we >>>>> can come up with specific solutions. (Say common svn area where both >>>>> committers can have access). >>>>> >>>> >>>> Let me back up. What is broken in the current layout that mandates us to >>>> go >>>> for different TLPs? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Also, Don't mind me, i repeat my mantra for the n-th time again. Those >>>>> who are actively working on a day to day basis should be taking the >>>>> decisions. What we are doing is not working and i propose we try >>>>> something new to see if it will work. >>>>> >>>> >>>> My point is exactly this. Why do we waste time on going to fix something >>>> which is not broken? Let's get back to work ;) >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Samisa Abeysinghe >> >> http://people.apache.org/~samisa/ >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> > > > > -- > Davanum Srinivas :: http://davanum.wordpress.com > -- Davanum Srinivas :: http://davanum.wordpress.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
