And, to support your point, a person from Sun is already the chair of one
of the working groups at ws-i and they have people actively participating
in all others.
Andre Tost
"Anne Thomas
Manes" To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> cc:
Subject: RE: Document style web
services
11/22/2002 12:14
PM
Please respond to
axis-user
<flame>
This is a political issue between Microsoft and Sun. Just because senior
management at these companies act like little boys in a school yard, it
doesn't mean that WS-I is just some Microsoft puppet organization.
There are plenty of other serious Java players that have board seats at
WS-I. To wit: BEA, IBM, and Oracle. (also Fujitsu and HP) Microsoft only
has
one seat on a board of 9 (soon to be 11).
I think it was a serious mistake on the part of WS-I not to invite Sun to
be
on the board. It certainly has had a significant impact on the group's
credibility. But I can understand the reluctance of some of the players
(not
just Microsoft) to invite them to play. Sun was very slow to get involved
with Web services. For a very long time Sun was trying to undermine the
entire SOAP/WSDL/UDDI infrastructure in favor of ebXML. (I know. I was at
Sun at the time fighting in favor of SOAP.) Sun was being less than
constructive in the standards efforts. Would you invite someone to be on
your board if you had doubts about their good intentions?
Almost all major web services contributions have been joint efforts by
Microsoft and IBM. Once the specs have been published, the two of them
invite others to join the work. I don't see a whole lot of Microsoft hoop
jumping going on. I see constructive joint effort. Sun is as welcome to
join
the effort as anyone else. I was very pleased to see them join WS-I. They
certainly didn't win any points by standing in a corner and pouting because
they weren't picked first.
</flame>
Anne
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Friday, November 22, 2002 11:59 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: Document style web services
>
>
>
> It may be old news, but its still true. Some of us are getting tired of
> being made to jump through hoops to accommodate Microsoft.
>
>
>
>
> "Anne Thomas
>
> Manes" To:
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED] cc:
>
> t> Subject: RE:
> Document style web services
>
>
> 11/21/2002
>
> 05:01 PM
>
> Please respond
>
> to axis-user
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> That's old news.
>
> Sun is now a member of WS-I. WS-I has added two new seats to the
> board, and
> there will be a vote in March to elect the new board members. Let's hope
> that Sun gets elected.
> http://www.aspnews.com/news/article/0,,4191_1488041,00.html
>
> Anne
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Dennis Sosnoski [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 6:41 PM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Re: Document style web services
> >
> >
> > Anne Thomas Manes wrote:
> >
> > >WS-I has just published its Basic Profile
> > >draft, which only supports document-style. Pretty much every
> > SOAP vendor is
> > >involved with WS-I, so it won't be long before all SOAP
implementations
> > >generate document style by default.
> > >
> > I think WS-I has serious credibility problems, especially since it came
> > out that Microsoft's participation was conditional on Sun being
excluded
> > from a major role in the organization. To quote from a Bill Gates memo
> > in reference to WS-I which was made public during the antitrust trial
> > (as reported in http://news.zdnet.co.uk/story/0,,t288-s2110205,00.html,
> > for one source): "I can live with this if we have the positioning
> > clearly in our favour. In particular, Sun not being one of the
> > movers/announcers/founding members." I'm sure that, as a participant in
> > WS-I, you're familiar with these issues, Anne. This credibility problem
> > is certainly going to influence how WS-I proposals are treated by the
> > industry.
> >
> > If Sun becomes a full coequal participant in the WS-I organization
it'll
> > go a long way toward establishing WS-I as a bona fide forum for
> > supporting interoperability. Given Sun's ownership of Java and control
> > over Java standards it's hard to take an organization that excludes Sun
> > seriously on these issues.
> >
> > - Dennis
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
