On 23/11/14 19:07, Andrew McGlashan wrote: > On 23/11/2014 11:14 AM, John Hasler wrote: >> Renaud (Ron) OLGIATI writes: >>> But they are anathema to the "We are systemd of Borg, resistance is >>> futile" crowd. > >> And then there is the "Systemd is the Borg! Kill! Kill!" crowd who jump >> into every mention of Systemd to piss and moan about the other crowd, >> which then retaliates. While I can and will killfile you others >> evidently can't or won't and so every attempt at a rational discussion >> of anything Systemd related gets disrupted. I don't care for Systemd >> but I am going to have to live with it and so I want to hear about it's >> bugs, misfeatures, and workarounds. I do *not* want to hear about your >> conspiracy theories nor do I want to hear any more sneering ridicule of >> anyone who questions Systemd. Both "crowds" should just STFU. You are >> doing nothing but antagonizing people.
Well said John, and thanks (for the record, I'm *not* pro-systemd, nor anti - just keeping my mind carefully open, as I did with the introduction of devfs and udev). > > Not to mention the fact that the list is NOT seeing the breadth of the > problems with systemd -- the views of the not so few are being squashed > time and time again with post moderation. > > You will never see the full picture of the problem if you only listen to > what is allowed to be received via the debian-user list ... and you are > deluded if you think the problem only concerns a small limited number of > people. > > A. > How many people subscribe to this list? How many people follow the various reposting of this list? While there may be a large number of people who have "problems" with systemd, many of which are Debian Users - most of them are polite, and present their objections/queries in a rational manner (you would do well to learn from them). May I respectfully suggest that context is everything - only a very small number of people*[*1]*, like yourself, make persistent, bullying, vague claims about "problems" with systemd - while continually ignoring that it is *not* forced on them. To suggest that you represent the silent majority is the height of arrogance (and delusion?) - don't you think. Likewise the "belief" that anyone who patiently tries to help you solve the problems you continually refuse to *define* and *substantiate* as fanbois or part of a "conspiracy" - does little to give credulence to your claims. It does nothing gain you respect, divides the community upon which *you* feed, and drowns out the legitimate concerns of others due to your incessant bad behaviour. Your behaviour, not surprisingly, irritates and offends users in general - to which you then claim is evidence of persecution. There's a term for that - a classification even. If you want fair hearing be respectful and intelligent - resorting the hyberbole implies that your "argument" is short on facts. List your *specific* problems with systemd and put them up *once* for people to read and reply to. Twice implies lack of forethought, three times implies? And you've ranted[*2 how many times? Likewise your *half-dozen* similarly behaved "Veteran Unix Administrators". There are many who have "concerns" about systemd - you and your behaviour do not represent them. This is a community of "users" - most who don't code or package, some of which make a "contribution" in terms of reportbug. Those that code and package make a "commitment" (it's an "eggs and bacon" thing if you need an analogy). Developers and packages would not cease to exist if user did, the opposite is the opposite. Clearly you haven't considered that - please do. [*1]https://lwn.net/Articles/620441/ [*2]] a term I apply *after* continually, and exhaustively, assuming best intentions on your part. Time I could have spent trying to help people with non-organic problems. Kind regards (sincerely - try and embrace the difference instead of trying to destroy those things 'you' don't want). -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/5471a07b.1040...@gmail.com
