Very sensible! +1
> On 4. Dec 2019, at 10:02, Chesnay Schepler <ches...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> I believe this to be a sensible approach by Dawid; +1.
>
> On 04/12/2019 09:04, Dawid Wysakowicz wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Sorry I think I was not clear enough on my initial e-mail. Let me first
>> clarify two things and later on try to rephrase my initial suggestion.
>>
>> 1. I do not want to count all votes from @apache.org addresses as binding
>> 2. I do not want to discourage people that do not have @apache.org
>> address from voting
>> 3. What I said does not change anything for non-committers/non-PMCs
>>
>> What I meant is that if you are a committer/PMC please use an apache.org
>> address because then the person that summarizes the votes can check in the
>> apache directory if a person with that address is a committer/PMC in flink
>> project. Otherwise if a committer uses a different address there is no way
>> to check if that person is a committer/PMC or not. It does not mean though
>> that if you vote from apache.org this vote is automatically binding. It just
>> allows us to check if it is.
>>
>> To elaborate on Xuefu's example. It's absolutely fine for you to use an
>> apache address for voting. I will still check if you are a committer or not.
>> But take me (or any other committer) for example. If I use my non-apache
>> address for a vote and the person verifying the vote does not know me and my
>> address, it is not easy for that person to verify if I am a committer or not.
>>
>> Also it does not mean that other people are not allowed to vote. You can
>> vote from other addresses, but those votes will be counted as non-binding.
>> This does not change anything for non-committers/non-PMC. However if you are
>> a committer and vote from non apache address your vote will be non-binding,
>> because we cannot verify you are indeed a committer (we might don't know
>> your other address).
>>
>> I agree the additional information (binding, non-binding) in a vote helps,
>> but it still should be verified. People make mistakes.
>>
>> I hope this clears it up a bit.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Dawid
>>
>> On 04/12/2019 04:58, Dian Fu wrote:
>>> Thanks Dawid for start this discussion.
>>>
>>> I have the same feeling with Xuefu and Jingsong. Besides that, according to
>>> the bylaws, for some kinds of votes, only the votes from active PMC members
>>> are binding, such as product release. So an email address doesn't help
>>> here. Even if a vote is from a Flink committer, it is still non-binding.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Dian
>>>
>>>> 在 2019年12月4日，上午10:37，Jingsong Lee<lzljs3620...@apache.org> 写道：
>>>>
>>>> Thanks Dawid for driving this discussion.
>>>>
>>>> +1 to Xuefu's viewpoint.
>>>> I am not a Flink committer, but sometimes I use apache email address to
>>>> send email.
>>>>
>>>> Another way is that we require the binding ticket to must contain
>>>> "binding".
>>>> Otherwise it must be a "non-binding" ticket.
>>>> In this way, we can let lazy people continue voting without any suffix too.
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>> Jingsong Lee
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Dec 4, 2019 at 3:58 AM Xuefu Z<usxu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Dawid,
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for initiating this discussion. I understand the problem you
>>>>> described, but the solution might not work as having an apache.org email
>>>>> address doesn't necessary mean it's from a Flink committer. This certainly
>>>>> applies to me.
>>>>>
>>>>> It probably helps for the voters to identify themselves by specifying
>>>>> either "binding" or "non-binding", though I understand this cannot be
>>>>> enforced but serves a general guideline.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Xuefu
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Dec 3, 2019 at 6:15 AM Dawid Wysakowicz<dwysakow...@apache.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I wanted to reach out primarily to the Flink's committers. I think
>>>>>> whenever we cast a vote on a proposal, is it a FLIP, release candidate
>>>>>> or any other proposal, we should use our apache.org email address.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is not an easy task to check if a person voting is a committer/PMC if
>>>>>> we do not work with him/her on a daily basis. This is important for
>>>>>> verifying if a vote is binding or not.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dawid
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Xuefu Zhang
>>>>>
>>>>> "In Honey We Trust!"
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Best, Jingsong Lee
>
>
