On 2022-10-19 17:20, sebb wrote:
I agree that the podling does not need to *learn* anything from the Incubator.
However, the Incubator is also supposed to be where podlings grow
their community.
I think it is wrong to excuse the podling from the requirement to
build a community before leaving the Incubator.
What will we say to other podlings that fail to gather enough
community but are otherwise 'ready' to graduate?
I think this is a dangerous precedent.
I am not advocating that this is the new normal, but it *is* the normal
for these sort of projects. They just do not attract many contributors.
There are *millions* of weekly visits to lists.apache.org, there are
many other pony mail installations out there, and yet there is a very
limited desire to contribute, just as we see it with other mailing list
systems of the same type.
With my board hat on, I know that I am going to be asking, soon, where
the new contributors are hiding.
As a PPMC member, +1, but, at the same time, I acknowledge that I am
an absentee member of the project, and I don't, realistically, expect
that to change in the coming year, despite my oft-repeated goal of
sitting down to learn the code more, and see where I can contribute.
As to Sebb's remark about lack of response, for myself I can only say
"ApacheCon". I am *still* doing ApacheCon wrapup, and the last 2
months have been all ApacheCon, all the time.
In which case, I suggest waiting a month or so and trying again.
There is no need to rush this through.
No one is suggesting that this be rushed. My personal intentions were
and still remain to be trying for a graduation in November or December.
It is quite time-consuming to graduate a podling, and also
time-consuming to retire a PMC.
With regards to the social bits (discussing, voting on and formalizing
graduation), sure. With regards to the technical bits, graduation is
essentially a 15 minute job due to the improved tooling over the years.
I'll not get into the retiring part, as I think that's a tad premature :-).
We need to be reasonably sure that the podling has sufficient
community to operate before starting graduation.
If by 'sufficient community' you mean "being able to respond to issues
in a timely manner", then I think we have that. I can't think of any
instances where the ball has been dropped on any important matters.
There are both volunteer and corporate-backed interests in keeping this
project afloat.
Sebb
