Okay. Thank you Ryan.
On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 11:12 AM, Ryan Baxter <rbaxte...@apache.org> wrote: > Raj, I need to check with the board about what to do here. The board voted > to move the project to the attic so I have a feeling that will need to > happen first to officially retire the project in the Apache's eyes. Then > you can take the code and do what you please with the code. At this point > since the project has officially been terminated I don't think we can do a > release. > > On Sun, Nov 8, 2015 at 8:07 PM Raj Janorkar <raj.janor...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > Hi Ryan, > > > > Before moving to Github, It would be great to release the FINAL version > > with all the changes done in since last release. > > > > What says? > > > > On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 11:05 AM, Raj Janorkar <raj.janor...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Ryan, > > > > > > Thank you. > > > > > > I think it would be good if we officially move this project to github. > If > > > not possible then put this project to attic and then just create single > > > copy on github, so that we have one project for all dev community to > > > concentrate on. Otherwise we will end up creating same project in > > different > > > places with different versions and customization which is very hard to > > > track and focus on. > > > > > > If you all okay i can checkout the project from apache and put it into > > > github, if there is way anybody know directly moving from apache to > > github > > > then we can do that way. > > > > > > What you think about this Ryan/Chris/Darren and all others? > > > > > > Thank You. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 10:52 AM, Ryan Baxter <rbaxte...@apache.org> > > wrote: > > > > > >> Hi Guys, > > >> > > >> It is great to see your enthusiasm for the project! I still need to > go > > >> through the process of moving the project to attic in Apache, but I > > don't > > >> see why you cant take the pieces you want and start a "new" project > > >> elsewhere. > > >> > > >> On Sun, Nov 8, 2015 at 5:07 PM Raj Janorkar <raj.janor...@gmail.com> > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >>> Thats Great Site Darren. > > >>> Lets give new life to Shindig. > > >>> > > >>> I am sure there are so many other sites using shindig. > > >>> > > >>> Regards, Raj > > >>> > > >>> On Monday 9 November 2015, Darren Bond <db...@globalcad.com> wrote: > > >>> > > >>> > Hi Raj, > > >>> > > > >>> > We did the same and produced www.blueg.com > > >>> > > > >>> > Happy to share some experiences too. > > >>> > > > >>> > Kind regards, > > >>> > > > >>> > Darren > > >>> > > > >>> > ----- Reply message ----- > > >>> > From: "Raj Janorkar" <raj.janor...@gmail.com <javascript:;>> > > >>> > To: "Chris Spiliotopoulos" <chrysanthos.spiliotopou...@gmail.com > > >>> > <javascript:;>> > > >>> > Cc: "dev@shindig.apache.org <javascript:;>" < > dev@shindig.apache.org > > >>> > <javascript:;>> > > >>> > Subject: Terminate the Apache Shindig Project > > >>> > Date: Sun, Nov 8, 2015 12:51 PM > > >>> > > > >>> > Just to let you know > > >>> > > > >>> > I was fan of iGoogle, which is closed in 13. So as a fun and learn > > >>> > something i have implemented it - www.igoogleportal.com > > >>> > > > >>> > I can definitely share some working examples. > > >>> > > > >>> > Cheers. > > >>> > > > >>> > On Sun, Nov 8, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Chris Spiliotopoulos < > > >>> > chrysanthos.spiliotopou...@gmail.com <javascript:;>> wrote: > > >>> > > > >>> > > Hi Raj, > > >>> > > > > >>> > > well I guess this makes 2 of us! Let's wait for what others have > > to > > >>> say > > >>> > > just to get a clear view of all the perspectives. > > >>> > > > > >>> > > Cheers > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > On Sun, Nov 8, 2015 at 2:10 PM, Raj Janorkar < > > raj.janor...@gmail.com > > >>> > <javascript:;>> > > >>> > > wrote: > > >>> > > > > >>> > >> Hi Chris, > > >>> > >> i am ready. > > >>> > >> Last year i was thinking to write documentation with examples > but > > >>> > couldn't > > >>> > >> do that. i hate apache way of trunk and website. > > >>> > >> > > >>> > >> This time i can help creating few html pages. > > >>> > >> > > >>> > >> Regards, > > >>> > >> Raj > > >>> > >> > > >>> > >> On Sunday 8 November 2015, Chris Spiliotopoulos < > > >>> > >> chrysanthos.spiliotopou...@gmail.com <javascript:;>> wrote: > > >>> > >> > > >>> > >> > Hi all, > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > having listened carefully to all the voices from the community > > so > > >>> > far, I > > >>> > >> > have come down to the following conclusion. > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > There are many professionals among us that have been working > in > > >>> the > > >>> > >> shadows > > >>> > >> > supporting this project in diverse ways - evangelizing, > > >>> advocating, > > >>> > >> > integrating, etc. without the 'shoulders' of a bold-named > > company > > >>> like > > >>> > >> > Google or IBM (who has been the active maintainer of this > > project > > >>> for > > >>> > a > > >>> > >> > number of years now). > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > My gut feeling so far has told me that - as has already > happened > > >>> with > > >>> > >> many > > >>> > >> > other technologies - these companies usually invest an amount > of > > >>> time > > >>> > >> and > > >>> > >> > money for experimenting with different types of technologies > and > > >>> if > > >>> > >> things > > >>> > >> > don't go as planned in the long run, what seems to be > happening > > is > > >>> > that > > >>> > >> > some other company takes over on the experiment and so on, > until > > >>> no > > >>> > big > > >>> > >> > name is really interested any more. > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > During this lifecycle, many other companies are starting to > > adopt > > >>> the > > >>> > >> > technologies and they are indeed putting them into good use to > > >>> serve > > >>> > >> their > > >>> > >> > purposes. And this is exactly where we stand at the moment. > I > > >>> can > > >>> > >> totally > > >>> > >> > understand the feelings coming from Ichiro and Darren and at > the > > >>> same > > >>> > >> time > > >>> > >> > I get Ryan's point of view. So how do we handle this > situation? > > >>> > >> Speaking > > >>> > >> > for myself, as I come from Greece and I have to live and work > > in a > > >>> > >> country > > >>> > >> > that is in crisis mode for quite a few years now, all I can > say > > is > > >>> > that > > >>> > >> a > > >>> > >> > crisis can be the mother of invention and change for a better > > >>> > tomorrow. > > >>> > >> > And this is exactly how I see this situation - in a > metaphorical > > >>> way > > >>> > of > > >>> > >> > course :) > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > I think that now is the right time to make a change. Things > > have > > >>> > >> changed > > >>> > >> > in our industry during the last 10 years and so have trends > and > > >>> > >> > communities. Maybe 10 years ago, the Apache Foundation was > the > > >>> place > > >>> > >> to be > > >>> > >> > but now this is definitely not the case - of course this > doesn't > > >>> mean > > >>> > >> that > > >>> > >> > the foundation is not the birthplace of great technologies. > But > > >>> all > > >>> > the > > >>> > >> > action now is over at GitHub. > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > So, since Ryan gave us the green light (from the foundation's > > >>> > >> perspective) > > >>> > >> > that the project can be migrated, I'm outlining my proposals: > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > - We break down the Shindig project into a number of > distinct > > >>> > parts - > > >>> > >> > personally I've never used the OpenSocial features and have > > no > > >>> > >> interest > > >>> > >> > in > > >>> > >> > them since I'm heavily focused on the gadget containment > and > > >>> > >> rendering > > >>> > >> > facilities. But there are people like Rene who have > invested > > >>> a lot > > >>> > >> of > > >>> > >> > time > > >>> > >> > and work on extending the OpenSocial features. > > >>> > >> > - We give it a brand new name - never liked the name > Shindig > > >>> in the > > >>> > >> > first place (speaking for myself once more). I think that > > >>> this is > > >>> > >> very > > >>> > >> > important since we want to make a bold statement to > > communities > > >>> > that > > >>> > >> > this > > >>> > >> > technology is active, we're using it and others should try > it > > >>> out > > >>> > >> > because > > >>> > >> > it may solve them a number of problems. > > >>> > >> > - Create a modern web site on GitHub where we can all share > > our > > >>> > >> > experiences through show cases, usage examples and > tutorials > > >>> > >> > - We start thinking around the concept of a gadget-centered > > >>> > >> marketplace > > >>> > >> > - in the context of show casing stuff. If I remember > > correctly > > >>> > >> Darren's > > >>> > >> > team has already launched a project which is very similar > to > > >>> the > > >>> > >> iGoogle > > >>> > >> > web site so he could certainly provide some ideas. > > >>> > >> > - Issues and feature requests can be handled directly > though > > >>> GitHub > > >>> > >> in a > > >>> > >> > more agile and community oriented approach without any of > the > > >>> > >> > bureaucratic > > >>> > >> > processes imposed by the Apache Foundation. Once the > > >>> 'monolith' is > > >>> > >> > broken > > >>> > >> > down into different projects then it would be more > manageable > > >>> and > > >>> > >> people > > >>> > >> > having certain skills could join forces > > >>> > >> > - By utilizing technologies like Docker there is no need > for > > >>> > hosting > > >>> > >> > resources and sample material - we can bundle our examples, > > >>> show > > >>> > >> cases, > > >>> > >> > etc > > >>> > >> > in self-sufficient Docker images and host them over @ > > >>> DockerHub. > > >>> > The > > >>> > >> > integration with GitHub is seamless so this is a no brainer > > >>> > >> > - Reach out to Atlassian, Jive and the rest of the > companies > > >>> who we > > >>> > >> know > > >>> > >> > for sure that they have invested a lot in this technology > > (and > > >>> > >> actively > > >>> > >> > use > > >>> > >> > it) to help with this effort - e.g. Atlassian has extended > > >>> Shindig > > >>> > >> > container & engine to meet their requirements and they > > >>> definitely > > >>> > >> have > > >>> > >> > devs > > >>> > >> > who know the bits and pieces > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > So the question now for me is really simple. How many of us > > want > > >>> to > > >>> > >> move > > >>> > >> > over to the next phase without getting into any sort of > > >>> credibility > > >>> > >> issues > > >>> > >> > regarding our choices? +1 from me. > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > Kind regards, > > >>> > >> > Chris > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > On Fri, Nov 6, 2015 at 2:49 AM, Ryan Baxter < > > rbaxte...@apache.org > > >>> > <javascript:;> > > >>> > >> > <javascript:;>> wrote: > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > > I completely understand. I can't speak to the continued > > >>> support of > > >>> > >> > vendors > > >>> > >> > > who have adopted Shindig, but I would imagine that they > can't > > >>> just > > >>> > >> stop > > >>> > >> > > supporting the products consuming Shindig. I am sorry that > > this > > >>> > puts > > >>> > >> you > > >>> > >> > > in a tough position but this is a natural cycle of open > source > > >>> > >> software. > > >>> > >> > > With no community willing to support and enhance the project > > >>> there > > >>> > is > > >>> > >> not > > >>> > >> > > much we can do. If someone takes the code and the project > > >>> regains > > >>> > >> life > > >>> > >> > > somewhere else, that is great. > > >>> > >> > > > > >>> > >> > > On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 6:22 PM Ichiro Furusato < > > >>> > >> > ichiro.furus...@gmail.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> > > >>> > > >>> > >> > > >>> > >> > > wrote: > > >>> > >> > > > > >>> > >> > > > Hi Ryan, > > >>> > >> > > > > > >>> > >> > > > While the code is stable and available I can't go to our > CIO > > >>> and > > >>> > >> > > architects > > >>> > >> > > > and > > >>> > >> > > > advocate use of a project as the basis for our online > > >>> delivery if > > >>> > >> the > > >>> > >> > > > project has > > >>> > >> > > > folded. We were planning to replace literally five > separate > > >>> legacy > > >>> > >> > > portals > > >>> > >> > > > (that > > >>> > >> > > > have been accumulating like mold rather than serve as > > >>> > replacements) > > >>> > >> > using > > >>> > >> > > > Liferay, with our online widgets being replaced by Open > > Social > > >>> > >> Gadgets. > > >>> > >> > > > With > > >>> > >> > > > the demise of Shindig I assume Liferay's support of > embedded > > >>> > Shindig > > >>> > >> > will > > >>> > >> > > > likely disappear, and therefore my ability to advocate for > > its > > >>> > use. > > >>> > >> > > > > > >>> > >> > > > It's not the availability of the code, it's the living > > status > > >>> of > > >>> > the > > >>> > >> > > > project. If the > > >>> > >> > > > project is dead I can't very well suggest we base millions > > of > > >>> > >> dollars > > >>> > >> > of > > >>> > >> > > > online > > >>> > >> > > > delivery over the next 5-10 years on it. As I am > responsible > > >>> for > > >>> > >> that > > >>> > >> > > > decision > > >>> > >> > > > I could hardly be said to be responsible in advocating for > > >>> its use > > >>> > >> at > > >>> > >> > > this > > >>> > >> > > > stage. > > >>> > >> > > > > > >>> > >> > > > Sadly. > > >>> > >> > > > > > >>> > >> > > > Cheers, > > >>> > >> > > > > > >>> > >> > > > Ichiro > > >>> > >> > > > > > >>> > >> > > > On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 3:01 AM, Ryan Baxter < > > >>> rbaxte...@gmail.com > > >>> > <javascript:;> > > >>> > >> > <javascript:;>> wrote: > > >>> > >> > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > Ichiro, while the project will move to the attic, it > > doesn't > > >>> > mean > > >>> > >> you > > >>> > >> > > > can't > > >>> > >> > > > > continue to use it. If it is stable enough as it is > right > > >>> now > > >>> > for > > >>> > >> > you > > >>> > >> > > > than > > >>> > >> > > > > you should be able to continue to use it as is. > > >>> > >> > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 5:59 AM Ichiro Furusato < > > >>> > >> > > > ichiro.furus...@gmail.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> > > >>> > > >>> > >> > > >>> > >> > > > > wrote: > > >>> > >> > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > To add just one more voice to the chorus, I'm likewise > > >>> very > > >>> > sad > > >>> > >> to > > >>> > >> > > hear > > >>> > >> > > > > of > > >>> > >> > > > > > the demise of what > > >>> > >> > > > > > seemed (until this notice) to be a functional and > mature > > >>> > >> project. > > >>> > >> > For > > >>> > >> > > > the > > >>> > >> > > > > > past nine months I have > > >>> > >> > > > > > advocated replacing the four (!) existing (legacy) > > >>> aviation > > >>> > and > > >>> > >> > > > industry > > >>> > >> > > > > > delivery platforms of the > > >>> > >> > > > > > Meteorological Service of New Zealand (MetService) > with > > a > > >>> > >> > > > Liferay/Shindig > > >>> > >> > > > > > based site. Over the > > >>> > >> > > > > > past year we prototyped a replacement service and are > > >>> > currently > > >>> > >> > > > awaiting > > >>> > >> > > > > > the next project > > >>> > >> > > > > > funding cycle. Having to go back to our executive > > >>> management > > >>> > >> team > > >>> > >> > and > > >>> > >> > > > > tell > > >>> > >> > > > > > them that the > > >>> > >> > > > > > basic architecture of our proposed service is somewhat > > >>> > >> > embarrassing, > > >>> > >> > > > and > > >>> > >> > > > > we > > >>> > >> > > > > > will likewise now > > >>> > >> > > > > > need to reevaluate and design a new solution. As the > > lead > > >>> > >> designer > > >>> > >> > I > > >>> > >> > > > have > > >>> > >> > > > > > been quite happy > > >>> > >> > > > > > with the Shindig/Open Social Gadget technology, and we > > had > > >>> > >> looked > > >>> > >> > > > forward > > >>> > >> > > > > > to a robust > > >>> > >> > > > > > implementation cycle, replacing fifteen years of > crufty > > >>> > service > > >>> > >> > with > > >>> > >> > > a > > >>> > >> > > > > > shiny new Gadget-based > > >>> > >> > > > > > solution. > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > Sincere thanks to the development team for an > excellent > > >>> job, > > >>> > >> very > > >>> > >> > > sorry > > >>> > >> > > > > to > > >>> > >> > > > > > hear about it being > > >>> > >> > > > > > put into the Attic. There may have been inactivity in > > the > > >>> dev > > >>> > >> side > > >>> > >> > at > > >>> > >> > > > > > Apache but we were actively > > >>> > >> > > > > > using, and planning to use it for a substantial part > of > > >>> our > > >>> > >> online > > >>> > >> > > > > weather > > >>> > >> > > > > > delivery solution. > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > Ichiro > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 7:31 AM, Ryan Baxter < > > >>> > >> rbaxte...@apache.org <javascript:;> > > >>> > >> > <javascript:;>> > > >>> > >> > > >>> > >> > > > > wrote: > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > Hi fellow Shindig Devs, > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > I would like to let you all know that the Shindig > PMC > > >>> has > > >>> > >> voted > > >>> > >> > to > > >>> > >> > > > > > > terminate the Shindig project and move it to the > > >>> attic. I > > >>> > >> have > > >>> > >> > > > already > > >>> > >> > > > > > > informed the Apache board about the termination in > > this > > >>> > months > > >>> > >> > > board > > >>> > >> > > > > > report > > >>> > >> > > > > > > (below). > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > As most of you have probably noticed we have seen a > > >>> decline > > >>> > in > > >>> > >> > > > > > > participation in all aspects of the project over the > > >>> past > > >>> > >> months > > >>> > >> > > and > > >>> > >> > > > > the > > >>> > >> > > > > > > downward trend has been happening for over a year > now. > > >>> This > > >>> > >> can > > >>> > >> > > > > > certainly > > >>> > >> > > > > > > be seen in our reports to the board [1]. > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > If anyone has any questions please let me know, and > I > > >>> will > > >>> > be > > >>> > >> > sure > > >>> > >> > > to > > >>> > >> > > > > > keep > > >>> > >> > > > > > > everyone up to date as we transition the project to > > the > > >>> > attic. > > >>> > >> > > > Thanks. > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > -Ryan > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > [1] > > >>> > >> > > > > > >>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/SHINDIG/Board+Reports > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > ---------- Forwarded message --------- > > >>> > >> > > > > > > From: Ryan Baxter <rbaxte...@apache.org > > <javascript:;> > > >>> > <javascript:;>> > > >>> > >> > > > > > > Date: Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 9:29 PM > > >>> > >> > > > > > > Subject: Terminate the Apache Shindig Project > > >>> > >> > > > > > > To: bo...@apache.org <javascript:;> <javascript:;> > < > > >>> > bo...@apache.org <javascript:;> > > >>> > >> > <javascript:;>> > > >>> > >> > > > > > > Cc: priv...@shindig.apache.org <javascript:;> > > >>> > <javascript:;> < > > >>> > >> > priv...@shindig.apache.org <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> > > >>> > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > WHEREAS, the Project Management Committee of the > > Apache > > >>> > >> > > DirectMemory > > >>> > >> > > > > > > project has chosen by vote to recommend moving the > > >>> project > > >>> > to > > >>> > >> the > > >>> > >> > > > > > > Attic; and > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > WHEREAS, the Board of Directors deems it no longer > in > > >>> the > > >>> > best > > >>> > >> > > > > > > interest of the Foundation to continue the Apache > > >>> Shindig > > >>> > >> project > > >>> > >> > > > > > > due to inactivity; > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the Apache > > Shindig > > >>> > >> > > > > > > project is hereby terminated; and be it further > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > RESOLVED, that the Attic PMC be and hereby is tasked > > >>> with > > >>> > >> > > > > > > oversight over the software developed by the Apache > > >>> Shindig > > >>> > >> > > > > > > Project; and be it further > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > RESOLVED, that the office of "Vice President, Apache > > >>> > Shindig" > > >>> > >> is > > >>> > >> > > > > > > hereby terminated; and be it further > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > RESOLVED, that the Apache Shindig PMC is hereby > > >>> terminated. > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > > >>> > >> > > > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > -- > > >>> > >> > Chris Spiliotopoulos > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > Solutions Architect | @LinkedIn > > >>> > >> > <https://www.linkedin.com/pub/chris-spiliotopoulos>| @Twitter > > >>> > >> > <https://twitter.com/chefArchitect> > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > -- > > >>> > > Chris Spiliotopoulos > > >>> > > > > >>> > > Solutions Architect | @LinkedIn > > >>> > > <https://www.linkedin.com/pub/chris-spiliotopoulos>| @Twitter > > >>> > > <https://twitter.com/chefArchitect> > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > >> > > > > > >
