Mark,

I specifically asked about posts being cut - whether people were subject to
'compulsory redundancy' or just not replaced or posts 'not filled' , etc is
irrelevant.

If you want to continue on the content of this request I suggest you move
it to email - or you could use the 'what do they know' annotation feature.

Paul /)/+)

On 17 March 2012 21:41, Mark Goodge <[email protected]> wrote:

> On 17/03/2012 09:59, paul perrin wrote:
>
>> As a regular requester to brighton and hove... I can say...
>>
>> The system used to work quite well - then the person responsible went on
>> long term sick leave and it fell apart - I understand she is now back,
>> and the backlog is being cleared.
>>
>> However, while in the past a 'proper response' would be generated and
>> then passed back via the FoI bod - now it seems the council are just
>> sending 'conversational' style replies which are then forwarded as
>> responses without attributation. FoI is being treated as if its a
>> conversational question from a resident
>>
>
> That is, actually, how it's supposed to be. The FOIA doesn't formalise any
> kind of FOI process, and nor does it make any distinction between a
> conversational question from a resident and a request explicitly made under
> the FOIA. All that the FOIA does is stipulate that if you ask for
> information - irrespective of how formally or informally you ask it - and
> they have the information, they can't simply say "We're not going to tell
> you". They either have to tell you, or justify not telling you.
>
> There is, therefore, no such thing as a "proper response" in law. Provided
> that the information sought is supplied, it doesn't matter in the slightest
> whether it's on gilt-edged letterheaded paper addressed to "Dear FOI
> Requestor" and personally signed by the mayor or as part of a
> conversational email response begining "Hi mate, managed to dig out the
> stuff you wanted, I've bunged it in a spreadsheet for you".
>
>
>  - instead of part of a legally
>> defined obligation for openness.
>>
>
> It's an obligation for openness, not an obligation for process.
>
>
>
>> i.e. Around a year ago I asked about top and bottom council earners, and
>> got a spreadsheet from a department showing the top and bottom - great.
>> Recently - I asked for an updated copy and got nothing (it may have got
>> lost in the mess of no-one in charge and/or misdirected replies) rather
>> than chase/find/trace it - I formulated a new request and outlined of
>> why I was asking - I got a one paragraph brush off response ('we are not
>> aware of any compulsory redundancies among the lower paid workers') sent
>> via the FoI bod, but with no indication of who had drafted the
>> pathetic, inadequate response (which of course arrived on the very last
>> day allowed).
>>
>> http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/**request/have_jobsposts_been_**
>> lost_as_a_re#outgoing-184068<http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/have_jobsposts_been_lost_as_a_re#outgoing-184068>
>>
>
> As far as I can see, that question has been answered. You wanted to know
> if any jobs had been lost as a result of the "Living wage" change; the
> answer is "no". The fact that you used the phrase "posts cut" and the
> responder used the phrase "compulsory redundancies" is irrelevent; in this
> context they mean the same thing.
>
>
>  Currently going to internal review.
>>
>> I recently discovered that a request I made a few years ago about
>> whether a process had been audited led to the council instigating an
>> audit the very next week - something they didn't feel the need to
>> mention in their response at the time...
>>
>
> How did you discover that?
>
>
>  You just can't trust 'em.
>>
>
> As I said before, if you treat FOI authorities as the adversary then you
> will inevitably intepret any response in that light.
>
> Mark
>
>
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