On Thu, 27 Sep 2001, Jeffrey W. Baker wrote: >> What developers can do is to recommend ATI cards to end-users, so there is >> larger need for the drivers and larger chance someone would be willing to pay >> for them. > >It seems to me that Linux drivers are an area where ati can claim some >advantage over nvidia. If ati developed a really hot linux driver package >for the 8500, and released the source code, they would probably claim a >very large share of the Linux 3d and game market, such as it is.
I'm not agreeing nor disagreeing with that, but I do want to point out something important. There currently isn't any large Linux 3D game market. Myself, and others reading this likely _want_ that to happen, yes. Hoqwcwe - there currently is no steaming cash cow of games in Linux, or general 3D in Linux - yet. I think the foundation is seriously there yes. DRI is IMHO one of the most successful advanced open source projects right now. For it to continue to succeed, people need to purchase products from those that are or were funding the development of DRI. >Today, there is absolutely no reason to buy the radeon 8500 if >you use linux. That is not true. And words like that are exactly what works _against_ progress of DRI and open source video drivers. >2d is barely there, 3d is definitely not there. The hardware is not publically available yet to my knowledge, except for developers, however fully functioning 2D drivers have just been submitted to XFree86 CVS by ATI. I have tested them, and find they work well. ATI did this open source work in house, and they contributed it to XFree86. That development definitely cost them money I would presume. The specs for that hardware is available to developers under the exact same circumstances of previous ATI hardware - no change. And the Radeon 8500 drivers work fairly well IMHO for being just released. There is no reason to believe they wont continue to be well supported. Support future development buy purchasing their existing well supported hardware. >If your choice was limited to geforce3 and the radeon 8500 for >3d, you would definitely go with the geforce, because it is the >only one that currently works. I would go with the Radeon 64 for 3D. It is open source. Different people have different requirements though. >Problem: I don't think the linux game and 3d market can support the driver >development. Let's pretend that 1 full-time employee could produce the >radeon 8500 driver in 6 months. Let us also pretend that it costs, in >total, US$250,000 to employ this genius. Finally, let's assume that an >open driver buys ati 100% of the linux market. Is that market big enough >to offset the $250,000? Depends on ati's margins but my instinct says no, >or maybe barely. While your numbers are speculative, I believe the point you're making in the last paragraph is quite accurate. It more or less boils down IMHO to - if people want _real_ hardware support either implemented by their vendor, or contracted out - there _has_ to be a market for that vendor to make money. In the case of 3D, that means there has to be a much larger 3D market in Linux. How big "much" is, is only known to each of the respective hardware vendors. Another thing to consider is this: How does a hardware vendor *know* what operating system and/or software you are using/buying when you purchase their hardware? In general, unless you tell them personally somehow, tell your distributor, tell your computer store where you buy all your hardware, etc. That info - 'marketing data' - does not make the connection back to the vendor. The only data the vendor gets (I am totally guessing here) that indicates actual hardware purchase for a given OS, is in premade preinstalled systems. Workstations and desktops. IMHO, before 3D is widely used in Linux on a largescale, 2D desktop and workstation usage needs to raise high enough that hardware vendors see themselves making enough money to more than cover their R&D costs of supporting Linux/open source. If we _all_ do do our part by supporting vendors that offer us good level of open source support right now, perhaps they wont offer the same levels of support in the future as they have in the past. I strongly recommend that everyone vote with their wallet. That is the best way to not only ensure the future of graphics in Linux, but to expediate it. Take care, TTYL P.S. The viewpoints, and opinions expressed above are solely my own, and do not reflect the views of anyone else. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mike A. Harris Shipping/mailing address: OS Systems Engineer 190 Pittsburgh Ave., Sault Ste. Marie, XFree86 maintainer Ontario, Canada, P6C 5B3 Red Hat Inc. Phone: (705)949-2136 http://www.redhat.com ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris Red Hat XFree86 mailing list: [EMAIL PROTECTED] General open IRC discussion: #xfree86 on irc.openprojects.org ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~# rm -f /bin/laden _______________________________________________ Dri-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dri-devel
