Many years ago, we used the EMC grill, top and bottom of chassis, coated with
an intumescent material that swelled with heat above a certain temperature to
shut off the air flow and starve the fire. Max ventilation was essential to
normal operation, thus the coating for a fire condition, also temp detector to
shut off the fans.
On Tuesday, September 17, 2019, 2:00:25 PM EDT, Pete Perkins
<00000061f3f32d0c-dmarc-requ...@ieee.org> wrote:
Oh yes, I remember doing safety consulting with a company on a telecom product
but they wanted to handle all of the telecom GR issues themselves. One morning
the technician hauled me into a small conference room and showed me a video of
the burn test which was started by putting a burner into the product to start
the fire. This compact product burned from rail to rail in the 19” rack each
board lighting off its neighbor till all that was left was fiberglass with any
remaining components which had not fallen out flaming to the ground; the V-1
boards couldn’t hold back the spread of fire. He was appalled, they didn’t
know what to do about it. I led him thru the sequence just watching the fire
move along. He took me to the ME manager who was incensed that the tech had
shown me the video. It took a couple of weeks but then I was called in to go
over the fire with the product development team. I arranged to project the
video on the wall in front of the team so large that they could see the details
vividly and talked them thru the two views taken of the fire -15 minutes each.
When they understood the details they attacked the problem and finally found a
solution that they could live with. The solution involved reducing the
ventilation holes in the top and bottom such that the fire choked because of
lack of Oxygen and didn’t spread so quickly. It took a long time to fix it and
the ME manager was reassigned during the process.
:>) br, Pete
Peter E Perkins, PE
Principal Product Safety & Regulatory Affairs Consultant
PO Box 1067
Albany, Ore 97321-0413
503/452-1201
IEEE Life Fellow
p.perk...@ieee.org
Entropy ain’t what it used to be
From: N. Shani <nshani...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2019 10:00 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Do We Need Flame Retardants in Electronics?
Just a small addendum: while indeed GR-1089 has all kind of immunity
requirements, it is GR-63 that has the non-electrical requirements, one of
which is the flame spread testing.
Having witnessed a few of those passing or failing tests, the various RBOCs had
their own spin on those requirements. Recall Verizon? SBC? Each with their own
emphasis.
Naftali Shani, Ottawa, ON
Happily retired
On Sep 17, 2019, at 12:47, Cortland Richmond <k...@earthlink.net> wrote:
When I went to work at DSC/Alcatel USA in 1997, we had to meet GR-1089.
Telcordia had/has a lot of immunity and ruggedness requirements. Yes, we did
flammability tests. I've been in the Hinsdale Central Office too (I was
looking at an EMI complaint at one of their subscribers) ad got the "real
story" from some folks who'd been there when they had their famous fire. Don't
open a door to get hoses in until it's cooled down enough that oxygen doesn't
turn the whole bay into an inferno...
https://www.ideals.illinois.edu/bitstream/handle/2142/95/Illinois%20Bell%20Telephone%20Fire,%201988.pdf?sequence=2
Cortland Richmond
Ret. but "on-call" at Belcan
On 9/16/2019 19:00 PM, Richard Nute wrote:
Well, the obvious way to determine whether flame-retardants have reduced the
incidence of death or injury is to stop using flame-retardants and compare
before and after. The problem, of course, is if we are wrong…
This is one argument that is often used to retain ALL requirements in safety
standards. However, in many cases scientific or engineering analysis can show
(or not show) that a requirement contributes to the product’s safety.
I’m not aware of illness or injury due to any flame-retardant in normal
operation of products, although there is plenty of evidence of illness and
injury from the chemicals themselves and disposal of the products.
Rich
On Mon, Sep 16, 2019 at 2:32 PM Richard Nute <ri...@bendbroadband.com> wrote:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/do-we-need-flame-retardants-in-electronics/
“…there has never been any valid statistical demonstration that flame
retardant chemicals of the types and concentrations used in consumer products
have resulted in death or injury reduction,” says Vytenis Babrauskas…
The article is more than 5 years old. Nevertheless, thought-provoking.
Enjoy!
Rich
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