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Message list:
1. Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
2. Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
3. Re: Florida Keys suggestion - Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Sun-N-Fun itinerary-
Plan A
4. Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Sun-N-Fun itinerary - Plan A
5. [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
6. Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Sun-N-Fun itinerary - PlanA
7. Re:[COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
8. Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
9. RE: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
10. RE: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
11. RE: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
12. Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
13. Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
Messages:
From: "Randy Hougham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Coupers-Flyin" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: "Randy Hougham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
Bill took me for my first ride in an Ercoupe. Then he took my son for his
first ride too. He has been a great help to me while I have been working
on
my grandfather's Ercoupe. He has given me books and all kinds of
informarion. He has even been out to the Sandwich airport to visit me and
my
project.
Let's all remember Bill in our prayers. I'll be praying for his recovery.
Randy Hougham
NC87384
Grandpa's Ercoupe
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From: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Reply-To: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
I'll check with Dennis.
Syd
John Silberman wrote:
----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following
any advice in this forum.]----
Is there an address at the hospital where we can send cards/
jsilberman
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From: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Reply-To: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Florida Keys suggestion - Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Sun-N-Fun
itinerary- Plan A
Good suggestions, Susan. We'll talk it all over at the Banquet and
decide how and if we are going to do the Keys.
Syd
Susan wrote:
Here's a suggestion ... Why not plan on flying to Ft. Myers and taking
the ferry from Ft. Myers down to Key West and then back to Ft. Myers?
You can leave the planes at Ft. Myers, travel to Key West on the ferry
(I've heard it is an enjoyable trip), spend some time experiencing Key
West and the lower Keys (maybe rent a couple of vans for traveling up
the Keys a bit to experience some enjoyable dining experiences, like
Cookie's at Geiger Key Marina (10 miles north of Key West) where you
can eat hamburgers or fish sandwiches or pulled Cuban pork sandwiches,
etc. while sitting outside along the water watching the Navy fighter
jets taking off from Boca Chica and flying nearly overhead on their
way out to do fighter training.
On a good day, Marathon is about an hour's drive from Key West - worth
visiting the FBO there to get acquainted, then have lunch in Key West
at the Island Tiki Bar or the Quay Restaurant, then either head up to
Islamorada for dinner at the Hogg's Heaven restaurant/sports bar out
on the water (great food), maybe spend the night in Marathon or
thereabouts, and drive back down the Keys the next day exploring other
places along the way. Head back to Key West for a bit more fun in the
sun (lunch at Turtle Kraawls, dinner at Monty's - both of them on the
water in Schooner Wharf area, etc.), perhaps overnight and return on
the Ferry the next day from Key West back to Ft. Myers.
Susan
On Mar 6, 2006, at 9:05 PM, Sydney Cohen wrote:
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following any advice in this forum.]----
Hi Don,
You're right, I've never been to the Keys, and maybe I've assumed
too much. I sure wouldn't want to ditch my plane in the ocean, and
I'm sure the others would feel the same way. Maybe we should
reconsider flying to the Keys. I didn't know how few options we
would have.
You're also right about landing at Crystal River at 7 pm. We
should probably plan to stay overnight in Camilla, GA, and refuel
at Crystal River the next morning before flying to Sun-N-Fun.
Thanks for your suggestions. It's always nice to have another set
of eyes look over my work.
Syd
DONALD BOWEN wrote:
Hi, Syd,
To land where, Syd? You seem to assume excellent visibility,
no low cloud cover, and glide ratios that our Coupes don't
have. Moreover, let's not confuse "need" (as required by
regulations), with "need" as required when your engine quits
and you are immediately in deep doo- doo. The "land" in the
Keys is narrow, densely populated with trailer homes and fish
camps and mangrove swamps and a heavily -traveled single
highway. I recognize that you have put a good effort into your
flight planning, but prudence dictates (in my opinion) a
conservative approach. . For example, your plan to arrive at
Crystal Riverat 7 pm (impending darkness) doesn't leave much
room for error. Why all the hurry ? In that vein, I'd guess
that some of your flying group will "hang their hat and asses"
on your calculations, and potentially just plan to "follow the
leader". It is only a guess, but I have led many yacht cruises
to and from the Bahamas, and am consistently amazed at the
captains who don't carry appropriate or update charts, spare
fuel filters, etc. They just follow. Try that in the Miami
Terminal Approach Area, and your wingmen would be in deep
trouble the minute they lost sight of the leader, and didn't
know EXACTLY where they were, and where they were going.
Incoming and departing huge commercial jets are everywhere !
Yes, I believe you have " been there and done that", but the
responsibilities of leadership can weigh heavily on your
shoulders, when others of lesser experience have their lives
are at stake and (might be ) completely depending on you.
I do not mean to second guess you, Syd, and will now butt out,
wth the suggestin that you and your flight slow down a bit and
take time to smell the roses (aka swamp cabbage) here in
beautiful, but not always VFR, Florida. Good luck.
.
SEMPER FIDELIS
Don Bowen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----Original Message Follows----
From: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Sun-N-Fun itinerary - Plan A
Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2006 18:22:37 -0600
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following any advice in this forum.]----
Not true, Scott. You need lifesaving equipment (life
preservers or raft) if the flight is beyond gliding distance
to land. Our flight crosses only about 5 miles of water, so
with enough altitude, we can easily glide to land.
Syd
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You only need flotation devices if the flight is operating
commercialy. Is it a good idea to carry them anyways? Yes.
But if you dont have room, and you are following a
highway, just have fun and do it.
Scott
N94428 '50 G
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suddenly you are doing the impossible." - Francis of Assisi
"It is much better to live in a world that you have participated in
defining, than in one that has been defined for you." - Susan Horton
"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can
change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has." -
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share the passion and action of his time, at peril of being judged not
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From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Sun-N-Fun itinerary - Plan A
Yes it is true you "need" them if you ditch in the water. However they are
not required by the FAR's unless the flight is operated for compensation
or hire. I dont have my FAR book with me or I would look it up.
Scott
----------------------------
From: "John Stevens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]
Reply-To: "John Stevens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
One of the primary reasons that cellphones are prohibited in aircraft is
that
they (MAY) interfere with aircraft electronics. That is obvious. Just
put a
cellphone near a CRT computer monitor or near an unshielded set of
computer
speakers and you can either see or listen to the electromagnetic
interference
that they generate. Secondarily a cellphone will step up its' power
relative
to the signal that it is receiving so that these new phones can save as
much
battery power as possible - so inside a commercial airliner you are in the
equivalent of a faraday cage with little openings to the "outside world".
This will make a cellphone step up its power to try and poll a cellsite so
that it can function. Now fill that faraday cage with lots of people with
cellphones and all of the possible mixing of signals bouncing around
inside.
That's why they don't allow it. One person with a phone might be benign
but
add 20, 30, 40 or more people to that mix and you might have a serious
problem
if the right circumstances allow.
Next, add "line of sight" to the equation - cellphones are designed to
connect
to the nearest "cell" that they can receive from ground level. This takes
into account obstructions like buildings, cars, hills and other natural
obstructions to your horizon. Get 4500-5500ft up in a coupe and you have
nearly unobstructed views of potentially hundreds of cell towers and the
voting system that the cell systems use can get a bit confused when you
have
simultaneous access to 20+ cell sites at the same time. At 5500ft your
horizon (on a perfect day) is 97 miles away - using the general formula of
(sqrt (altitude in feet / 0.5732))=number of miles line of sight to
horizon
Saying that - flying cross country in rural Georgia where the sites aren't
too
close together you probably aren't hurting anything, but anywhere within
or
near an urban centre you'll be causing some confusion for sure.
The old "mobile" telephones use a fixed frequency channel to communicate
with
the public telephone network, the "airphones" use a combination of
satellite
and fixed ground stations to relay your call into the public network.
They
were designed from the get go to be in planes.
Anyway - probably WAY over explained this one. But my $.02 and my one
post a
year....
John - EX CF-RGD - I MISS MY COUPE!
----------------------------
From: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Ercoupe Hangar Flying <[email protected]>
Reply-To: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Sun-N-Fun itinerary -
PlanA
Sounds good to me, Ken. Anyone who was planning to meet us at Camilla,
go to Thomasville instead. (You'll notice that I've put this email back
on the Flyin site where it should be, not on the Tech site.)
Syd
Kenneth Doyle wrote:
Syd,
Thomasville, Ga (TVI) is another good place to stop on the way down.
It is about 30 miles SE of Camilla. They are building a new FBO
building that may be completed by now. I stopped there coming down to
Florida in June, and ended up having to spend the night due to
weather. They were real nice, gave me the crew car overnight, and
knew Lynn Nelson from previous visits. It's not much further South
from Camilla. There are several motels in town, about 3 miles away.
(Turn right when you leave the airport :-)) FBO number is 229-225-4313.
You might also think about Cairo Grady, Ga, about 25 miles S of
Camilla. I haven't been there, but I understand they have a cafe. I
would check on it's hours before expecting it to be open in the late
afternoon or early morning. 229-377-6700 is the FBO number.
About 80 miles south of Camilla is Perry, Florida (40J) I haven't
been there, but I believe there is a cafe on the field and they have
24 hour fuel. But I don't have any information that says they have a
crew car, and as best as I can tell the motels are a good 2 miles
distance from the airport. But Perry is about halfway between
Carmilla and Crystal City. FBO number is 850-584-2823.
Just food for thought.
Ken
----------------------------
From: "Bruce Coons" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Ercoupe Hangar Flying" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: "Bruce Coons" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re:[COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
Hello all, this is Bruce, Bill's oldest son. I get the list digest every
day as my dad sometimes want to ask me about GPS issues. I just want to
report that I just talked to my dad on the telephone in the ICU just now
and he is doing much better than yesterday. It looks like they busted up
the clot and he is breathing without the ventilator. He sounded pretty
much like his old self. I also reminded him he can't go yet - he has to
finish a book. We're not sure when he will get out of the ICU and get
near a computer so he can email the list. But I'm sure he would want me
to let you all know that he is doing better. I appreciate all the support
I see for my Pop. Thanks to all for your prayers.
Bruce Coons
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----------------------------
From: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Bruce Coons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
Hi Bruce,
Very happy to hear the good news. Please pass along our best wishes
to your dad. He's a great guy and a good friend.
Syd Cohen
Bruce Coons wrote:
----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following any
advice in this forum.]----
Hello all, this is Bruce, Bill's oldest son. I get the list digest
every day as my dad sometimes want to ask me about GPS issues. I just
want to report that I just talked to my dad on the telephone in the
ICU just now and he is doing much better than yesterday. It looks
like they busted up the clot and he is breathing without the
ventilator. He sounded pretty much like his old self. I also
reminded him he can't go yet - he has to finish a book. We're not
sure when he will get out of the ICU and get near a computer so he can
email the list. But I'm sure he would want me to let you all know
that he is doing better. I appreciate all the support I see for my
Pop. Thanks to all for your prayers.
Bruce Coons
[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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From: "Ed Burkhead" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'Bruce Coons'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: "Ed Burkhead" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Bill Coons needs our prayers
Bruce,
YES! Glad to hear of his improvement!
Ask him to please take all possible care. We're looking forward to
hearing
from him and, I hope, seeing him again.
Ed Burkhead
http://edburkhead.com
ed -at- edburkhead???.com (change -at- to @ and remove "???")
----------------------------
From: "David Douglas Winters" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'John Stevens'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,<[email protected]>
Reply-To: "David Douglas Winters" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
Hmmmm,
So, we should not use cell phones on mountain tops?
Last time I was on Pikes Peak, I couldn't get one decent connection.
Im not sure this is working out for me, logically.
After a bunch of year in communications...and specifically
communications security...introducing the new upper-end freq
technologies, I surmise more bureaucratically centered issues here.
See, at altitude, you MAY have access to distant cells beyond those in
your immediate area. This makes you much more difficult to
localize....until the law mandates GPS data transmission from every
phone.
Anyway, as I recall, the equation for line of sight horizon is 1.144 *
sqr rt (height of eye in feet) = distance to the horizon in nautical
miles. (This assumes the horizon is at sea-level...which, of course, it
ain't, as a rule.)
For radar freqs, substitute a multiplicand of 1.23.
How do we get such different numbers?
Grins,
Dave Winters
N2797H
-----Original Message-----
From: John Stevens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:54 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following
any advice in this forum.]----
One of the primary reasons that cellphones are prohibited in aircraft is
that
they (MAY) interfere with aircraft electronics. That is obvious. Just
put a
cellphone near a CRT computer monitor or near an unshielded set of
computer
speakers and you can either see or listen to the electromagnetic
interference
that they generate. Secondarily a cellphone will step up its' power
relative
to the signal that it is receiving so that these new phones can save as
much
battery power as possible - so inside a commercial airliner you are in
the
equivalent of a faraday cage with little openings to the "outside
world".
This will make a cellphone step up its power to try and poll a cellsite
so
that it can function. Now fill that faraday cage with lots of people
with
cellphones and all of the possible mixing of signals bouncing around
inside.
That's why they don't allow it. One person with a phone might be
benign but
add 20, 30, 40 or more people to that mix and you might have a serious
problem
if the right circumstances allow.
Next, add "line of sight" to the equation - cellphones are designed to
connect
to the nearest "cell" that they can receive from ground level. This
takes
into account obstructions like buildings, cars, hills and other natural
obstructions to your horizon. Get 4500-5500ft up in a coupe and you
have
nearly unobstructed views of potentially hundreds of cell towers and the
voting system that the cell systems use can get a bit confused when you
have
simultaneous access to 20+ cell sites at the same time. At 5500ft your
horizon (on a perfect day) is 97 miles away - using the general formula
of
(sqrt (altitude in feet / 0.5732))=number of miles line of sight to
horizon
Saying that - flying cross country in rural Georgia where the sites
aren't too
close together you probably aren't hurting anything, but anywhere within
or
near an urban centre you'll be causing some confusion for sure.
The old "mobile" telephones use a fixed frequency channel to communicate
with
the public telephone network, the "airphones" use a combination of
satellite
and fixed ground stations to relay your call into the public network.
They
were designed from the get go to be in planes.
Anyway - probably WAY over explained this one. But my $.02 and my one
post a
year....
John - EX CF-RGD - I MISS MY COUPE!
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----------------------------
From: "Ed Burkhead" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Cflyin" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: "Ed Burkhead" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
Practical thought - I always figured that if I really needed to use my
cell
phone while flying, I'd drop down to 500' or so to make my call to
minimize
cell problems.
Ed Burkhead
http://edburkhead.com
ed -at- edburkhead???.com (change -at- to @ and remove "???")
----------------------------
From: James B. Brennan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Ed Burkhead" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: James B. Brennan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
My naughty little secret is I have a Pilot USA PA-400ST intercom that
plugs a cell phone right in and you talk via the headset (cockpit noise
is still a problem), but I've only used at modest altitude in areas
with few cell towers. I suppose you all know about these intercoms
that take cell phones. Also takes full stereo music if you're in a
place and in a mood not to carry on with radar service (I have a
Surecheck Trafficescope Micro which gives me some peace of mind - I can
squeak it onto the top middle of my glareshield even with the flat
windscreen w/ velcro).
I haven't noticed anybody mentioning using 122.75 - isn't that the
"air-to-air" frequency, the ersatz "CB" freq for pilots?
Jim
----------------------------
From: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Reply-To: Sydney Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] AIRBORNE CELL PHONE USE
Yes, when we do the Sun-N-Fun flight I plan to do our plane to plane
chatting on 122.75. If that's crowded we'll go to 122.85. Sorry for
not mentioning it.
Syd
James B. Brennan wrote:
----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following
any advice in this forum.]----
My naughty little secret is I have a Pilot USA PA-400ST intercom that
plugs a cell phone right in and you talk via the headset (cockpit
noise is still a problem), but I've only used at modest altitude in
areas with few cell towers. I suppose you all know about these
intercoms that take cell phones. Also takes full stereo music if
you're in a place and in a mood not to carry on with radar service (I
have a Surecheck Trafficescope Micro which gives me some peace of mind
- I can squeak it onto the top middle of my glareshield even with the
flat windscreen w/ velcro).
I haven't noticed anybody mentioning using 122.75 - isn't that the
"air-to-air" frequency, the ersatz "CB" freq for pilots?
Jim
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