Clough, rcl...@verizon.net
9/13/2012
Leibniz would say, "If there's no God, we'd have to invent him
so that everything could function."
----- Receiving the following content -----
From: Craig Weinberg
Receiver: everything-list
Time: 2012-09-12, 20:03:27
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Racism ? How's that implied ?
On Tuesday, September 11, 2012 8:32:21 AM UTC-4, rclough wrote:
Hi Craig Weinberg
I am intolerant of stupidity and deception, particularly
when the idea of carbon credits pops up. This suggests that
"Global warming" is just a method of raising taxes,
diminishing coal and oil, and even globally sharing the wealth.
Thankfully china won't go along with this stupidity.
It all seems to be politics rather than science.
I don't know enough about it to say too much about it. I think
that the
point is to make it political so
that the greatest polluters will have an incentive to pollute less.
Otherwise, why would they ever reduce
emissions? Personally I think that the only issue that matters is
overpopulation. As long as we have
seven billion people making billions more people, nothing will
stop the
devaluation of they quality of human life,
and of human lives. Whether it's the threat of running out of oil,
food,
water, or money, it doesn't really matter
which comes first. It's like putting more and more fish in an
overstocked
fish tank, the bigger ones just
eat more and more of the smaller ones while the whole thing fills
up with
crap.
Craig
Roger Clough, rcl...@verizon.net
9/11/2012
Leibniz would say, "If there's no God, we'd have to invent him
so that everything could function."
----- Receiving the following content -----
From: Craig Weinberg
Receiver: everything-list
Time: 2012-09-11, 00:40:08
Subject: Re: Re: Racism ? How's that implied ?
Hi Roger,
It's ok not to be obsessed with cleaning up the environment, but
why be
intolerant of people who are? Same with people who spend a lot of
time
talking in public about issues of racial discrimination. If you
are going to
speak and act on behalf of millions of people who are not speaking
and
acting, it is understandable that you might also be the type of
person who
is strongly motivated.
What you don't seem to appreciate is that being able to not have
to think
about race is a luxury that non-whites do not have. That doesn't
mean you
have to make the world fair for everyone, but the least that we
who have
that luxury could do is acknowledge that we have that privilege.
Have you
ever considered what it would be like for you in a world with an
alternate
history? Where the Cherokee Nation developed guns and steel before
the
Europeans and colonized it using Siberian slaves instead? You
could listen
to descendants of those invaders and slavers discuss how the
whining of pink
people, their scapegoats and victims for centuries in a hostile
land, is
really not their cup of tea.
Craig
On Monday, September 10, 2012 7:19:44 AM UTC-4, rclough wrote:
Hi Craig Weinberg
Not that I am against cleaning up the environment, but I am not
obsessed with the idea. Integrating with Nature is also a main
principle
of the Communist Manifesto.
Roger Clough, rcl...@verizon.net
9/10/2012
Leibniz would say, "If there's no God, we'd have to invent him
so that everything could function."
----- Receiving the following content -----
From: Craig Weinberg
Receiver: everything-list
Time: 2012-09-09, 16:23:54
Subject: Re: Racism ? How's that implied ?
On Sunday, September 9, 2012 2:58:32 PM UTC-4, Stephen Paul King
wrote:
On 9/9/2012 2:21 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote:
On Sunday, September 9, 2012 1:41:37 PM UTC-4, Stephen Paul King
wrote:
Hi Craig,
Why are we even considering the thoughts of paranoids? Are they in
control
of our daily lives?
Hi Stephen,
I agree, I was responding to what Roger said about liberals:
"ironically and paradoxically they see the world in terms of race.
Conservatives attempt to live by facts. I never
saw racism in what what I wrote until you brought
the subject up."
which sounded to me like 'conservatives aren't racist, liberals
are',
which - although conservative thought has some admirable virtues,
I can say
without hesitation that tolerance for racial and gender diversity
is not one
of them. That's why I brought up JBS and KKK, to show the
absurdity of that
claim, since the most racist hate groups are known to be political
right
wing extremists and not left wing extremists.
HI Craig,
The contest of recrimination is not winnable, but let's try for the
sake of the discussion.
Personally I don't know of any left wing extremist groups in this
country
- not that there aren't any but even self-proclaimed anarchists
seem to stay
out of trouble.
I guess that you have never heard of
1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_First!
2) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_Liberation_Front
I had heard of Earth First but not much. Yeah, I think it's fair
to call
them left wing eco-terrorists. Unfortunately the way they are
going about
it, using arson and destruction will only serve to discredit their
cause and
provide a ready excuse for stepping up surveillance and security
operations
around the world. I don't think that mainstream liberals are aware
or
support groups like this though generally. Contrary to the
overwhelming
drift to the right by conservatives, groups like these have not
seemed to
influence the politics of the mainstream (Democrats can't really
even be
called liberals, more like fiscal conservatives who are socially
moderate).
3) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenpeace
What do they do that is bad? Do they threaten innocent people?
Maybe they
are over-zealous and unrealistic about ecological priorities but
it's a drop
in the bucket compared to the global machine they are up against.
From what
I see it looks like they mainly are concerned with protecting
human beings
in general: http://yqyq.net/81737-Istoriya_i_dostizheniya_Greenpeace.html
Certainly they are not racists or bullies of innocent people.
4) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Students_for_a_Democratic_Society
SDS lasted from 1960-1969, so it hasn't been relevant for almost
50 years.
I had a professor who was in SDS. Extremely nice and gentle guy.
He said he
had a metal plate in his skull from the FBI. His class was on
revolutionary
movements, talked about SDS, the IWW and labor unions. He seemed
to have a
mature and reasonable perspective on the 60s
need more?
sure. my point was about racism though. Are there any groups of
white
racists who are liberal?
In other parts of the world, there are certainly left-wing violent
extremists but I don't guess that they are racially motivated in
particular
(unless maybe the distribution of wealth and power falls along
racial lines
in their area). What are the left wing presences in the US?
Farmers markets?
Small organizations that try to help people get birth control or
protect
people from being poisoned by industry?
It might be helpful if you laid out for us the definition of the
terms
that you are using. What exactly is left-wing and right-wing?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-wing_politics
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-wing_politics
Why can't we just get along?
The left wing are those who see themselves as being the people who
want to
just get along or, if politically active, oppose those who prevent
us from
getting along. Left wing means tolerance, which means a certain
degree of
intolerance of intolerance. That's where it gets dicey.
I'm not sure who the right wing thinks they are. Patriots?
Grownups who
don't like to see people get anything without paying a price? Not
sure.
To my mind, while I can understand why liberals would be
criticized as
whiny, weak, and impractical, I think conservatives who do not
understand
why they are criticized as racist, anti-intellectual bullies are
in deep
denial or just sheltered from other viewpoints.
Craig
From my point of view we need objectivity.
I'm on board with that.
Tell me why didn't trickle down economics work? Why did Bush's 8-
year
presidency end in such catastrophic failure? Why haven't the corps
making
record profits behaved as the 'job creators' they are supposed to
be?
Craig
--
Onward!
Stephen
http://webpages.charter.net/stephenk1/Outlaw/Outlaw.html
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