Le lun. 24 juin 2019 à 20:52, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < [email protected]> a écrit :
> > > On 6/24/2019 11:08 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > > > Le lun. 24 juin 2019 à 19:30, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < > [email protected]> a écrit : > >> >> >> On 6/24/2019 2:29 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >> >> >> >> Le lun. 24 juin 2019 à 11:18, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]> a écrit : >> >>> >>> On 24 Jun 2019, at 05:55, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On 6/23/2019 5:40 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >>> >>> >>> On 21 Jun 2019, at 21:49, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On 6/21/2019 5:35 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >>> >>> >>> On 21 Jun 2019, at 09:04, Bruce Kellett <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> On Fri, Jun 21, 2019 at 4:26 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> To disconfirm MWI you'd have to observe statistics far from the >>>> expected value, >>>> >>> >>> To make my point more strongly, that is the wrong way round. Observation >>> of statistics far from the expected value is what would be required to >>> confirm MWI. >>> >>> >>> I don’t see this at all. >>> >>> >>> >>> The fact that we don't observe such results is the strongest possible >>> case against MWI! >>> >>> >>> ? >>> >>> The probability to see a deviation is the same in both Everett, and >>> Copenhagen. The deviation expected is the same, so if there is a deviation, >>> it can hardly be used to claim one theory is more correct than the other. >>> >>> >>> But as Bruce points out Tegmark's machine gun experiment is effectively >>> being carried out by each of us. >>> >>> >>> That is quantum immortality. On this list I have defend this, but >>> Tegmark rejected it, and claimed that the survival to quantum suicide does >>> not entail quantum immortality. He might have changed his mind since, >>> perhaps. >>> >>> >>> >>> So if each of us lives on a million years in some branch of the MW, then >>> each of us will experience 99.9% of our life as a very old person among >>> people younger than 100yrs. >>> >>> >>> Unless there are intimidate realities in between Earth and Heaven. >>> >>> >>> It would still imply that each person would experience only a small part >>> of their existence surrounded by other persons whose age differed by less >>> that 120yr from their own. And so each of us should be surprised that we >>> find ourself in exactly that kind of world. >>> >>> >>> >>> Using some anthropoid argument, but like fine tuning, I tend to agree >>> with Vic that is is not really convincing, and should be handled >>> mathematically. Only progress in the mathematical theology will show if >>> this threat Mechanism or not. >>> >>> Bruno >>> >> >> The thing is we should first be born before being 1000000 years... so it >> seems not surprising finding yourself "young", that you are with other >> "young" people. >> >> >> That's seems to implicitly assume that everybody starts at the same time, >> so they are young together and then old together (in the branches they >> survive). I see no justification for conditioning on being young, since >> the point of the argument is that given quantum immortality the time you >> are young is of measure zero. >> >> Brent >> > > You have to be young first, your actual moment is not randomly sampled > from all possible you moments, it is ordered. As very old is very unlikely, > when in your first years, you should not find yourself around very old > people. > > > What is "ordered"? A sample is just a sample, it has no order. If > quantum immortality is true, then you must exist at all ages. And a sample > from that distribution is unlikely to find you young. Sure, if you > condition on being young, then you will see young people around > you...because whether you are young or not you will see young people around > you. The problem is that YOU are most likely to be old. > The thing is you had to be young first. You're talking with ASSA in mind. ASSA is nonsense. > > Brent > > >> >> If our age was randomly selected, then I agree it should be a surprise >> finding yourself young... but as you cannot be old *before* having being >> young *you have to* find youself young first in the flow of your life. >> >> Quentin >> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brent >>> >>> That is the whole subject of mathematical theology. Computer science >>> justifies jumps and intermediate realities. It is not an obvious subjects, >>> but the nuances given by incompleteness provides some light. Some personal >>> experience, like with some plants, can help, but can also mislead. Nothing >>> is obvious, and everything requires a lot of work. >>> >>> Bruno >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brent >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/c0263226-63a2-183b-2e0b-c093be94bc20%40verizon.net >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/c0263226-63a2-183b-2e0b-c093be94bc20%40verizon.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/FDF9CDE1-D3EA-45F6-8DEC-20659FC0F1B9%40ulb.ac.be >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/FDF9CDE1-D3EA-45F6-8DEC-20659FC0F1B9%40ulb.ac.be?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/c4f526ad-1ed0-d143-328c-5409fd16b642%40verizon.net >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/c4f526ad-1ed0-d143-328c-5409fd16b642%40verizon.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/B2423766-B9BA-4B22-9FB2-5831E7B63121%40ulb.ac.be >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/B2423766-B9BA-4B22-9FB2-5831E7B63121%40ulb.ac.be?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> >> >> >> -- >> All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy >> Batty/Rutger Hauer) >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAMW2kAqzRY4%2BEq65xNSBeS3%2BAFomEXDjJrbe0kQ9fkH90AAubQ%40mail.gmail.com >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAMW2kAqzRY4%2BEq65xNSBeS3%2BAFomEXDjJrbe0kQ9fkH90AAubQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/f3e90284-955f-ce3f-ab98-eada1c47070d%40verizon.net >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/f3e90284-955f-ce3f-ab98-eada1c47070d%40verizon.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAMW2kAoTRHwFbTaYyOb6GFYCv8mPEdq3HHkeZ005GiRx2dCmFg%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAMW2kAoTRHwFbTaYyOb6GFYCv8mPEdq3HHkeZ005GiRx2dCmFg%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/c3e6979e-40e9-4c71-2b6b-4d436a377135%40verizon.net > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/c3e6979e-40e9-4c71-2b6b-4d436a377135%40verizon.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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