According to my calculations, if you couldn't even be depended on to set a table in the campus dinning room, then I wouldn't trust you with even washing a single dish, no matter what time or where you were born.
Apparently you sucked at being a bus-boy ay MIU - let's hope by now you've developed some skills, but judging by your current performance, or lack of same, I don't think I would even give you a job cleaning out the chicken coop on a farm. But, that's just my opinion. Maybe you could list a few skills so we could get a better idea of your work experience since 1975. Thanks. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <mjackson74@...> wrote : OK August 29th, 1956 8:23 am born Greenwood, SC which is 34.1897° N, 82.1547° W So what does my chart indicate I would be "good at" (other than criticizing TM). I am asking as a pronounced skeptic. From: salyavin808 <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 3, 2015 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Maybe this is why things get so screwed up? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <noozguru@...> wrote : Sal, can you post an article about a field of science you know something about so we can discuss it and ask you question about? Eh? I thought I already had What fields of science are you expert in? Your horoscope looks like you might be good at real estate (loaded fourth house) but that's not exactly a science. Real estate, is that buying and selling houses? Not really, maybe more than some due to trades I've done but it's all just about being practical, it isn't something that engages me or that I'd go out of my way to take part in. And I hate all the bloody property shows on TV, I can't believe so many people are so incompetent and lacking in common sense. Still, idiots make better TV... As far as scientific interests go, you know what I like. I don't posts prehistoric stuff just because Dinosaurs look cool. Well, mostly I don't... And I don't post things that I don't understand in case someone does ask me a question. I post stuff because I find it interesting. Are you trying to get at me about something? On 03/02/2015 10:46 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : You certainly seem to have a high opinion of "science." Science has given us many wonderful things but there are also many things it cannot explain. Can you give us an example of something it "cannot" explain, as opposed to something it just doesn't have an explanation for yet? Of the latter there are many but there always were and problems always seem to get solved eventually. It depends how much effort is being put in. To not have a high opinion of the scientific method because it hasn't already answered all questions is a bit silly when you consider the track record. As for things it can't explain, I don't believe we will ever come across an unsolvable problem. The universe and everything in it is made of stuff. Stuff is understandable therefore the universe the universe is understandable. It will be interesting to be proved wrong on this one. However, this does not mean that those things are untrue or false. There are more things in heaven and earth, as Hamlet famously says to Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philsophy. I suspect that you actually know this very well, and that your apparent adherence to "science" is more of a pose than anything else. You were a spiritual seeker all those years and now you are telling me you don't believe something because "science" tells you it is not so? I suspect your "atheism" is also something of a pose, but that's another story. Feste: As far as what science says about astrology, I couldn't care less. If science says astrology is rubbish, that it cannot be true, etc. etc., that directly contradicts my own experience, repeated many times over half a lifetime. So I go with my own experience. I would be a fool not to. Turquoise: No, you would be a True Believer, ready to prefer your own subjective experience no matter what, and never even consider the possibility that it could have been mistaken -- even if science shows that it could very well be. I can understand that, but I cannot respect it. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <turquoiseb@...> mailto:turquoiseb@... wrote : From: feste37 <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com I'm not sure what you mean by "normal TM elitist." When I said that the astrologer Howard Sasportas also happened to be a TM teacher, I certainly did not mean that that automatically made him better than others. It was just a piece of information about him, that's all. Sometimes you read things that aren't there. I don't think so. I wasn't referring to Sasportas as all, and in fact neither his name nor any reference you made to him registered to me at all...I've never heard of the guy. I was referring to a *recurring* sense of elitism that I have perceived in you and in *most* long-term TMers, exemplified in statements like "I'm sorry for these scientific types whose minds are so closed. I wonder whether any of them have ever had their natal chart done by a competent astrologer. I would doubt it." That's elitism. You *look down* on those who don't agree with you. Another aspect of elitism, to an even greater degree, is, "I have studied it, you have not," which as Salyavin pointed out wasn't even said by Issac Newton about astrology. You say this a different way in your last statement below. For the record, I *have no problem* with your statements about having learned much about yourself from astrology. That's your concern. Mine is just that as a means of prediction, it's utterly and completely useless. Its predictive value has never and will never be proven in any kind of scientific context in which the astrologers are blinded from meeting their clients (and thus "cold-reading" them) and prevented from making generalized "predictions" that would apply to anyone. Another aspect of what I call "TM elitism" is that long-term TMers tend to believe pretty much *what they were told to believe* by Maharishi, and seem incapable of challenging or questioning it. We will have to agree to differ about astrology. That's fine with me. There's far more to it than intuition. I don't think so. As I explained to Sal, the readings I had were not "vague generalities." They were precise and accurate, and they very much related to me as a specific individual. You must have either seen some bad astrologers or have been so lacking in self-insight that you didn't recognize yourself in what they told you. Either that, or you are like all of those college students in the famous experiment who were all given the exact same horoscope to read and told that it was done for them personally. When the real nature of the experiment was revealed to them, over half refused to believe that it was true. Even when they compared the "readings" they'd been given line for line and found them identical, a few refused to believe it and thought that someone had switched them to play a trick on them. I think that it's more likely that you bought into generalities and at this point you don't want to even admit the possibility that they weren't generalities. But I have no interest in arguing with you...believe what you want. By the way, that "lacking in self-insight" was another elitist slam. One might suggest that YOU are so lacking in self-insight that you don't even realize when you're being an elitist. I remember hearing that MMY said that the only purpose of astrology was to predict the future. I have heard the same thing...that he said that. That is what I dispute. I don't think astrology is of *any use whatsoever* to predict the future. I don't think he cared at all about developing an understanding of the "relative" self, since he promoted transcendence of it. But I have to disagree with him over that. To me, predicting the future has been the least important aspect of astrology. That's fair, and I have no issue with you feeling that way. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <turquoiseb@...> mailto:turquoiseb@... wrote : On the contrary, I will step up to the plate and give Feste a detailed (and long) answer from my POV, largely because I think he was trying *not* to be mean...just a normal TM elitist. ("We can't help it if these skeptics don't know as much as we do.") :-) From: "Michael Jackson mjackson74@... [FairfieldLife]" <FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com> mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com I'll step aside and wait for Sal to answer this one - anything I say would just sound mean. From: feste37 <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com In my experience over the past 35 years, and I have said so on this board more than once, astrology is the best tool for self-understanding that there is—at least, the best I have found. Feste will probably be surprised to learn that I agree with him -- that astrology, used correctly, can be a tool for self-analysis and self-understanding. But so can tarot cards. So can "reading tea leaves." So can divining the future by examining the recently-removed entrails of an animal. *In my opinion*, in ALL of these cases it is possible for a person to gain valuable glimpses into the lives of themselves or others via any of these "divining tools." BUT, I would also say that IMO the "tools" have nothing whatsoever to do with what they "see" or what they "learn" except by acting as a trigger to set off their own intuition. The astrology charts don't do diddleysquat, and contain no useful information. The tea leaves likewise don't do diddley, and as for the entrails, well, they're just a big steaming pile of internal organs. How all of these things "work" IMO is that they *trick* the practitioner into accessing their own intuition. Think of it in terms of Disney's "Dumbo." Dumbo the elephant had huge ears, and after his friend gave him a magic feather to hold in his trunk, he could fly using them. But, after enjoying flying a lot, his friend finally told him that it was a normal old turkey feather, and that the only reason he could fly while holding it and couldn't fly before was that he *believed* he could if he was holding on to the "magic" feather. Well, that is how I think astrology, tarot, reading tea leaves, and reading the steaming entrails of lemurs "works." They are psychic tricks that the practitioners of these "arts" play on themselves to trigger their own latent intuition and kickstart it into working. (Message over 64 KB, truncated)
