All good points, and I do agree. But what you have to realize is that
sighted people need to memorize fighting game move properties just as well
as we do. Why? Because by the time they see that move and process it, their
character is eating a combo. The Massiah kick is a good example, however
that can't be avoided. Faqs are used just as often by sighted gamers,
remember, that's why they're there, to get to the specifics that command
lists never touch on. I can tell you, both from reading faqs and from how
often I play, that the move you're talking about is a ground kick. For the
simple reason that when he does the kick, he never actually leaves the
ground. And this is exactly why I like fighting games so much. We can play
them with the same skill and ability as sighted gamers, because we use the
same resources they do. Yes, you can see the move if you're sighted, but
that doesn't mean much... if you don't know that move hits opponents out of
the air, if you jump towards your opponent you'll still get whacked. In
short, sighted people have to do just as much to memorize move properties,
because you can't focus on the action itself if you're trying to think of
what each move is. That's a ticket to losing, because you need to be able to
know what the move is before you see the animation, which comes just at the
same time the sound cue does. As someone who does martial arts, it's a
valuable lesson which can also apply to fighting games. My teacher always
says, don't think, move! Meaning that as you're going through a sword form,
you should not think, but focus on the form you are performing and let your
body take over, therefore the mind, sword, body as one. Same thing here. So
the shouting out of move names is actually an advantage, especially since so
many of the times the move is shouted out before the motion is complete and
the move connects with your character. This is why fighting games are so
great... because you can't just pick one up and instantly be good. You have
to work, and do the exact same work sighted people have to do to get good.
Because remember. They may see the move, but it doesn't help them if they
don't know the properties of that move. And part of it is outsmarting your
opponent. But that's another story.
And that's part of the problem I find with audio games. Sounds should be
obvious, but not as obvious as some games make them out to be. Sound in an
audio game is so often too obvious it ruins the ambiance. In my personal
opinion, they only need to be distinguishable enough to know what's there.
bo,kura no daibouken is a great example... there's no targetting beeps, and
the enemies all sound like what I would imagine them to be realistically if
they were real. And that's part of the beauty of mainstream games... audio
games give you so much detail, but all the properties are explained to
you... there's no need to figure anything out. Mainstream games you honestly
have to work to figure out the ins and outs. And I disagree with sound being
an afterthought... street fighter has always had one sound for every single
attack. You know that there are three kicks and three punches. Each of those
sound radically different. Fireballs sound different depending on who throws
them. An uppercut with flames sounds different than one without. I just
don't see why if some mainstream blind gamers can figure them out, why
others can't. The ability to do it is there, and I've won small tournaments
in both street Fighter and MK 9. Nothing major, just things my friends and I
set up. How do I beat them? By outsmarting them... fightin games are less
about the mechanics than most people think. The menus don't matter. It's the
controls themselves, your character, and how much screwing with the
opponent's head you can do. And lastly, adventure modes and the like should
not be the main focus of a fighting game... the main focus is on the
fighting, preferably against human opponents. Not to say single player
content isn't nice. Very few fighting games have menu-driven story modes.
The only ones that do are usually ones that also suffer from stiff
mechanics. SC 3, and all the mk games n the ps2 are all good examples. MK 9
finds a nice balance, but Blazblue should be the one that every fighting
game should try and emulate.
I appologize about my misinterpretation about yur point with Japanese. True,
it's impossible for a blind gamer to learn how to read print just to
navigate menus. However, have you considered import games? Tons of people
import them from Japan, and most of us don't speak Japanese. So when it
comes to that, sighted gamers are in the same positions as we are... and
this is why I love import games. Because faqs for them always have menu
translations!
----- Original Message -----
From: "dark" <d...@xgam.org>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" <gamers@audyssey.org>
Sent: Monday, February 06, 2012 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Game accessibility was,Re: FINALLY! There is a Wii
game for the blind!
I'm afraid I do not agree there clemment.
In a fighting game it is not just necessary to memorize ten or 15 sounds,
but also know how those sounds correspond to specific moves.
For instance take Rufus "Messiah kick!" in street fighter 4.
Is it a ground kick or an air kick? what is it's level of attack? where
and when should you block?
It is not simply a matter of memorizing the phrase but of understand the
properties of the move that phrase belongs to, which can only be done with
a faq.
With an audio game, you are told those properties exactly within the game,
or indeed those properties become apparent from the game audio.
For instance, when i first played Q9, I did not! listen to all the
creature sounds, sinse I wanted a surprise. It was however obvious from
the position audio what I was coming to and that these were things that
needed hitting. "messiah kick" however does not reveal it's nature in
audio, because the audio statement of it's name is only an after thought
to a sighted player, they can instantly and without any shadow of doubt
see! what nature of move it is.
This is why the effort betwene a blind person and sighted person are not
the same. In an audio game, sounds are chosen for their representative
quality, up to and including the point that sounds are so representative
they may not be necessary to explain, where as in a mainstream game sound
is only a partial afterthought stuck in for effect.
Then of course, considder that in an audio game when sound memorization is
necessary, the sounds have been chosen! to be distinct enough to memorize.
Look at Mortal Kombat deadly alliance when virtually every character had
the same male or female voice actor, ---- or even games like the soul
calibur ones where some characters are played! by the same voice actor.
then of course, lets not forget those 3d adventure modes, ridiculously
menue heavy character creation and story modes, and all the other fun
stuff that beat em ups come with these days.
Though the arcade mode may be playable, what about the rest?
I'm also afraid you did not understand my point about learning japanese.
i do not despute the fact that learning japanese would be harder than
learning a sighted game menue. I only stated that where as it would be
physically possible! for an English language speaker to become equally
proficient in Japanese to the point that the effort required betwene a
Japanese speaker and an English speaker was the same, this is not true of
Blind vs sighted gamers.
A sighted gamer will always! be able to go through menues more quickly and
easily than a blind person, however good atmemorization you are, simply
because they! don't have to memorize anything whatsoever.
That is why the bockerano debuken case is not really relevant to the
disability arguement of mainstream games.
Beware the grue!
Dark.
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