Dear friends, thanks for the replies and engaging discussion. Can I propose that we start a google document to put down some of the ideas, and perhaps organise a follow-up chat or community seminar where the ideas can be discussed further? Outcomes can then be added to http://learnosm.org/en/ coordination/mapathon/ ?
I'll send you all invites to the document off list. I'll leave the document so that no sign-in is required, in case you don't want to have a google account! Bjoern On 20 November 2017 at 12:53, john whelan <jwhelan0...@gmail.com> wrote: > The interesting thing is when the very experienced iD specialist mapped a > building they did it by placing a dot in the four corners of the building > then the ways and tag were added very quickly by a short cut perhaps? > > By placing the four corners first you could see clearly where they should > go. I don't know how it was done but as an interim measure perhaps we > could teach this method of mapping buildings? > > Cheerio John > > On 20 November 2017 at 07:36, Stuart Ward <stuart.w...@bcs.org> wrote: > >> Having spent considerable time fixing iD editor squares non-square >> buildings, with random shared nodes, connected to roads, and areas, getting >> a better first time result is so important. >> >> I pains where you come across a square that they have clearly spent quite >> a lot of time mapping all the ins and outs of buildings. >> >> Stuart >> >> -- >> Stuart Ward M +44 7782325143 <+44%207782%20325143> >> >> On 19 November 2017 at 15:52, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM < >> blake.girar...@hotosm.org> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool >>> like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in >>> to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish >>> it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time >>> fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers >>> increase their productivity and accuracy. >>> >>> iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any >>> desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great >>> built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping >>> improve iD. >>> >>> If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the >>> building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed) >>> please contact me directly :) >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Blake >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan <jwhelan0...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> > and I totally concur with what Ralph has said. >>> > >>> > We asked people who were attending to install JAVA before they arrived >>> and I >>> > had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the stress on the >>> wifi >>> > network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of mice. The >>> particular >>> > maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had someone from the >>> local >>> > OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where mapping took >>> place. >>> > >>> > Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM with the plugins >>> > already installed so it was just a matter of "come in, sit down, >>> create an >>> > account, wiggle the mouse now you've mapped your first building." >>> Upload, >>> > then we got them to install JOSM on their own machine and when we >>> downloaded >>> > the tile again their previous mapping was there which reinforced the >>> idea >>> > that they were mapping on a live database. >>> > >>> > It could be just me but my feeling was we got a bit more engagement >>> with >>> > JOSM as they could see the underlying tags and having shown one mapper >>> how >>> > to join up two rectangles for an L shaped building I asked them to show >>> > another mapper how to do it when they wanted to know which helps on the >>> > confidence building side. >>> > >>> > For highways there is less to choose between the two editors but for >>> > buildings certainly for accuracy currently JOSM and the building_tool >>> plugin >>> > wins hands down. >>> > >>> > I think the large maperthons have their place but perhaps we need more >>> > mini-maperthons? >>> > >>> > Cheerio John >>> > >>> > On 19 November 2017 at 03:07, <ralph.ayt...@ntlworld.com> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> A useful guide to running your Mapathon can be found here >>> >> http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/ >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> There is no hard and fast rule to running a successful Mapathon. As I >>> >> point out, each Mapathon will evolve at it’s own pace and in it’s own >>> >> direction dependent the expertise of the people organizing and >>> leading, on >>> >> the people attending, the facilities available and the number of >>> people >>> >> involved. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> As to the choice of Editor used, I agree with John that JOSM is >>> preferred, >>> >> unfortunately that choice is not always available. We have found that >>> >> dealing with new mappers using school or corporate computers/laptops >>> it is >>> >> not always permitted to download other programmes, or if you have a >>> large >>> >> group uploading/downloading at the same time can cause problems for >>> the >>> >> available WiFi, and with one really large group we overloaded the OSM >>> >> server. So our choice is to start the large group of new mappers with >>> iD >>> >> Editor so that we can get them mapping as quickly as we can and then >>> deal >>> >> with any questions they have during the session. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> I do not count any success on how many squares have been completed >>> >> although it is encouraging to the group to be shown at the end how >>> much >>> >> their contribution has advanced the project they are working on. I >>> prefer to >>> >> concentrate on getting the mappers to a stage where they are >>> comfortable >>> >> with their mapping and confident enough to try mapping further on >>> their own >>> >> at home and hopefully interested enough to return for further >>> guidance. >>> >> Going around the room and looking at what they are doing is paramount >>> to >>> >> this success. Telling them that they have got it and their work is >>> good >>> >> gives them the assurance they need to continue and even become more >>> >> adventurous, so John is correct in saying that the one-to-one does >>> show more >>> >> promise and achieve better mapping. Even stopping to show a new >>> mapper how >>> >> to improve and correct their work has a very positive effect on their >>> >> confidence. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Working with small groups definitely is an advantage because of the >>> >> personal attention they can get, but will be more effective it you >>> can get >>> >> them meeting on a regular basis to build on their experience and >>> skill with >>> >> the various tools on JOSM. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> At the London monthly Mapathon we have three training sections >>> running at >>> >> the same time … iD , JOSM and Validating. And it is up to the >>> individual as >>> >> to which session they sign up to. If they want to start straight away >>> with >>> >> JOSM they are welcome to do so. The mappers know that there is going >>> to be a >>> >> Mapathon on the first Tuesday of every month so it becomes a fixed >>> date on >>> >> their calendar which does help with returning mappers. We also keep >>> the >>> >> email addresses of attendees and they will get invited back to future >>> >> Mapathons with an Eventbrite invitation. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> As a guide to success I would point you to the fact that most of the >>> >> trainers at the London Mapathons started off as newcomers and have >>> stayed >>> >> and progressed, a number of attendees have gone on to start up mapping >>> >> groups at their universities. Also at universities and corporate >>> offices >>> >> where we have run Mapathons they have started up inhouse Mapping >>> Parties and >>> >> Mapathons of their own. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Martin Dittus gave us some statistics early on in the process of >>> evolving >>> >> the London Mapathons which showed approximately 30% return rate but it >>> >> tailed of quickly, which is why we decided to offer the returning >>> mappers >>> >> the option of going onto JOSM, this helped the retention of mappers >>> and now >>> >> we also have a MidMonth Mapathon for experienced JOSM mappers to get >>> >> involved in more advanced work. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> To sum up, yes JOSM is desirable in getting good building mapping and >>> very >>> >> definitely when the mapping moves into dense city centres or slums >>> where >>> >> they are built butting up against each other. But then for people >>> with no >>> >> previous map experience the learning curve is very steep, having to >>> learn >>> >> about OSM, the Tasking Manager, the Editor, read Satellite Imagery, >>> drawing >>> >> the features and also tagging correctly so reducing this slightly by >>> using >>> >> the iD Editor to start with does make sense when you have a limited >>> time to >>> >> get them started. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> If you have any questions regarding getting started or running your >>> >> Mapathon feel free to email me and I will try to help where I can. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Hope some of this might be useful. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Regards >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Ralph >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> HOT mailing list >>> >> HOT@openstreetmap.org >>> >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > HOT mailing list >>> > HOT@openstreetmap.org >>> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot >>> > >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> ---------------------------------------------------- >>> Blake Girardot >>> Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> HOT mailing list >>> HOT@openstreetmap.org >>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> HOT mailing list >> HOT@openstreetmap.org >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > HOT mailing list > HOT@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot > >
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