Was the thread you refer to the one started by the poor soul from Israel?
Well, here's my opinion, nothing humble or shy about it.
I find all versions of Windows basically useless without major
tweakage. The shell sucks, there are no shell tools, and you can't focus a
window without topping it. Then there are all the rude apps that assume
that you want them to top because something happened, and you've got me
cussing. Even if I install Cygwin, half of what I need won't work in it
because they think that PATH variables should use the broken slash (javac,
verexample)
For my taste, Windows is too much abstraction: I want to control the
machine. Automatic transmissions are similarly evil, and the idea of
motorcycles with ABS is anathema. Don't get me started on bikes with
'linked brakes'.
If I have to install Cygwin + a bunch of hacks to make up for the blasted
thing having a monolithic windowing system (I can't use a different window
manager, I've got no virtualization of the desktop...) and I'd much rather
spend less time getting debian on the box.
That said, at my client I'm forced to use NT. I've got Cygwin, vim, and
Python, though. And JBuilder runs about the same either way.
On Wed, 7 Feb 2001, marc fleury wrote:
> well ok...
>
> there was a thread on /. 2 days ago about people abandoning linux on the
> client and going with windows. well duh! I dropped linux on my laptop and
> work primarily on a win2000 VAIO bad ass machine that I am VERY happy with.
>
> My server? linux. They come with win2000 I put linux on them. Why? cause
> it stable, manageable remote, comes with all the goodies I want and I (now)
> know how to secure them easily. Ease of use, ease of use.
>
> That is the one thing that I find funny in this new battlefield. Microsoft
> has a tradition of "eating from the bottom" and they are finding themselves
> eaten ALIVE by small linux servers. I was reading a "analyst" calling
> win2000 a "failure" because it was "failing" to kill the server market and
> few sites with *nix where switching to win2000.
>
> They bet the farm on win2000 as a IT server OS. At the top they have
> Solaris at the bottom they have Linux. Are they "irrelevant" on the server
> side technology standard driving????
>
> Dont get me wrong MS is a mighty company, I love win2000 on my laptop (use
> all day long) and I wouldn't go with Linux on my laptop for anything. But
> most of MS pattern was coming "from behind" leveraging a dominant position
> in the OS CLIENT. (think of Office, Explorer etc).
>
> Where is the dominant position on the SERVER. How much can a client
> monopoly drive SERVER technology. They *obviously* don't really understand
> the "service web" despite all the .net noise. The article was answering a
> dummy (i mean the question showed ignorance). So can they leverage a CLIENT
> monopoly on the SERVER? well it seems NOT MUCH. HTML as a client standard
> has made MS irrelevant. XML as a data formatting standard is making
> proprietary formats of storage irrelevant (blurb about Balmer putting his
> foot in his mouth).
>
> Finally J2EE is today 90% of the market place for APPLICATION SERVERS IN
> GENERAL (all categories C server, C++) where is the dominant position there
> as well to drive their standards?
>
> So I believe microsoft is *almost* irrelevant ;) on the web. Customers
> won't go in a "lock-in" on server because win2000 isn't going places there,
> linux is, solaris will remain. So their traditional "patterns" are not
> applicable anymore. I trust them to find something interesting but I am not
> shaking in my boots *yet*.
>
> Ok onto SUN. SUN KNOWS THAT .NET IS A "BOTTOM UP" THREAT AND THAT IBM AND
> BEA ARE NOT GOING TO FIGHT IT OFF. .NET will be a mass market technology,
> J2EE is still "ivory tower IT". Just like Solaris sits on top of Unix, BEA
> will sit on top of J2EE. US? WE SIT AT THE BOTTOM AND WORK OUR WAY UP, THAT
> IS HOW WE WILL "SQUEEZE" .NET BEFORE IT IS EVEN A SERIOUS THREAT.
>
> WE ARE A NECESSARY LITTLE FIGHTING DOG IN BATTLING .NET.
>
> So SUN has a big interest in helping us thrive we are their best and natural
> ally in fighting Windows and .net. you are right in saying that they must
> change their position with respect to Linux and Open Source Java... we are
> working on it, it will come
>
> marc
>
>
>
> |-----Original Message-----
> |From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> |[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Peter F. Spicer
> |Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2001 8:11 AM
> |To: jBoss Developer
> |Subject: RE: [jBoss-Dev] Sun ONE response to MS
> |
> |
> |Microsoft is doing some interesting things with the .NET platform, some of
> |which (actually a large part of which) is based on the precepts of the EJB
> |architecture ('attribute' based programming and the like). As far as
> |competition is concerned they are talented and aggressive. The
> |responses in
> |the link are good - but this guy is light weight so no victories gained.
> |
> |The bigger issue for the Java community is will it survive? - looks like it
> |will right now, but it is 'closed', Sun has control and MS is putting
> |together frameworks which allow the ingest and conversion of Java
> |technologies to their platform (COM+). Once this is complete, the millions
> |of windows folks will not need to switch - which is OK. BUT, market
> |pressures may force us to switch. Hence MS does the usual end-run
> |(Browser,
> |OpenGL, ....). Sun should let go or at least modify their current strategy
> |v. Linux and Java.
> |
> |BTW, check out the unification of the object models across all languages
> |(and extension to same) on the .NET platform - a slick piece of software
> |engineering.
> |
> |Sun BTW is also wrong about the relationship of software to hardware - just
> |because the interconnects become transparent does not change the
> |fundamental
> |equation.
> |
> |-- Peter
> |
> |-----Original Message-----
> |From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> |[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Rickard �berg
> |Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2001 6:38 AM
> |To: jBoss Developer
> |Subject: [jBoss-Dev] Sun ONE response to MS
> |
> |
> |Hey
> |
> |In case you haven't seen this:
> |http://www.sun.com/dot-com/realitycheck/headsup010205.html
> |
> |"So.. do you feel lucky.. punk!" "Kablaaam"
> |
> |Well.. uhm.. I thought it was funny anyway :-)
> |
> |regards,
> | Rickard
> |
> |--
> |Rickard �berg
> |
> |Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> |
> |
> |
>
>
--
Dan Christopherson (danch)
nVisia Technical Architect (www.nvisia.com)
Opinions expressed are mine and do not neccessarily reflect any
position or opinion of nVISIA.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you're a capitalist and you have the best goods and they're
free, you don't have to proselytize, you just have to wait.
-Eben Moglen
