from- janardan pati , secy. c.p.i.(m).orissa state committee .
everyone should condemned the killings of people in orissa or elsewhere -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- i am seeing every day in the net that some educated people are discussing about the cause of riot in orissa. there are causes,no doubt. but simple because there are causes,the riot and killing can not be justified . The murder of swami laxmananda is a plan one and subsquent killings,rape and arson are also planned one. Every one who has minimum concerned for the society can not support any barbaric activities in the name of religion. After all man has made religion. Religion came after man. It is man, and only man has built up civilisation. My appeal to you all to isolate the criminals and for that kindly use your energy. thanking you, janardan pati . --- On Sat, 8/30/08, Francis Minj <min [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: From: Francis Minj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Conversions at the root of carnage in Orissa To: [email protected] Date: Saturday, August 30, 2008, 2:36 PM Jharkhand Forum Hello Ventakat Subramaniam, I appreciate your candid observations. Every Indian would be careful lest someone might pull his dhoti from behind, the front part always unfurls, beauty, cadence, and history of a celebrated civilization. Vankat is no different in Eulogizing Hindus abroad. I am living outside India and disagree with your claim, I do not like to elaborate. It is of course better than what we see in India but casteism has its deep roots. Aryasamajis were originally inspired by Christians and Christians, especially in Tamilnadu, need to be inspired by the Aryasamajis. Venkat forgets to reveal the fact that in that region sometimes caste takes precedence over religion. There are rogue elements in all organizations and religions. It is equally wrong to blame the whole religion or organisation for a few wayward, there might be some fanatics in there. World Vision might be part of that. Similarly, anyone blaming Hinduism outright would totally mistaken. My sense is that people are blaming only a section of Hindus, i.e. some organizations. All these organizations "adapt" themselves to local contexts. The philosophy of some organizations are deplorably divisive and Venkat should also remember that like him, Christians also fund Hindu fundamentalist organizations. There is enough information on the internet. Rather than sniffing the complicity of Christians in the North East or any other part of India it would be wise to ask some soul searching questions about the genuine reasons for such tendencies. It would be quite enlightening to get some answers from the North Easterners about their links to extremists. Who nurtured them - government, politicians, business community or the Church? When women get raped by the armymen, where else will they seek protection? One can put up fence to protect the crop but if the fence itself eats the crop where do you go? This your Tamil proverb explains the situation well. Naxalbari is a Hindu village and extremism originated there.To my knowledge no Christian missionary, alien or Indian, was ever involved in incubating and nurturing that movement. Each region of the country has its specific issues and we need to tackle locally rather than blame the whole organization. I am convinced Cyprian will seldom be accepted by the Aryasamajis in the place. I have also visited the Aryasamjis and haven't been welcomed, also in Tamil Nadu. If one place is Similarly one cannot contest Rajani's personal experience. Francis Minj On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 8:35 AM, venkata subramanian <[EMAIL PROTECTED] com> wrote: Jharkhand Forum Well , well, Cyprian and Anjali It needs only a pedestrian intellect to know or guess where the mischief came from. Well, if you want to know of World Vision and its notorities follow this link to know what they did in Sri Lanka- ************ ***link is removed by moderator*** **** I was a contributor to this organisation through my credit card company ten years ago but when I knew of their activities, I stopped funding them. And I request Cyprian to visit Tamilnadu, and suit himself with the 'adivasi' type of church for him. No other higher caste church will offer him seats! But I promise Arya Samaj like organisations will initiate him into Sandhya and give him the sacred thread, and will introduce him to All the four Vedas. You will be really be made into the purohit that you want to be. So get your applications typed rightaway. It was your promise. Anjali will also find to her utter dismay that no castes are there in Arya samaji world. But for amusement she will find many Nadar Christians, Chetty christians, Naidu Christians, Reddy(YSR Reddy) christians and so on. Anyone listening, do not go by those imposters who assume high moral grounds in denouncing Hinduism. For all of you, I have this information. It is not Hinduism that is clinging to caste system. It is the secular state of India that is. In one stroke , they could have disbanded it in 1947. They did not. Look at the overseas Hindu community that has been so successful in spreading Hinduism far and wide. They did not carry the casteist tag. Iskcon had , by 2006, purchased 500 odd churches in Europe alone and converted them into Iskcon Temples. Villages after Villages are followers of Iskcon. The core point is that no force, no allopathic medicine in the name of Hallelujah, no harvesting of souls, no inquistion, no crusade wars and no aggression did it. Simply the power of Hinduistic ideals of Yoga ,and Dhyana did it. (which these churches are desperately trying to ape) If Cyprian was curious enough to have called up world vision and even the Police, why did he not have the same urge to clarify that with Pioneer ? I have come across many net articles to show the complicity of the Church and comrades and maoists. They replace one another in many places. The maoistsin Nepal are principally a christian force. He can get enough material from the net. The christists have only one agenda in India. That of grabbing the nation. They already have pocketed Northeast where a religious separatist struggle is on with the full backing of the Church. Ask any army man who has served in the north east and he will tell you with anger the complicity of the Church in the separatist insurgency. See this http://www.stephen- knapp.com/ baptist_church_ backs_terrorism. htm I was also a simple , so called apologetic Hindu fed day in and day out by the pseudo secular media about these ' innocent Christian' acts. But thanks to internet and the growing awareness among Hindus about their unique identity, ************ ********* ******* I am no longer apologetic about my Identity and if someone wishes to call me Right winger, or Hindutva man , I would rather welcome it. But let the comments come from right minded people , not from pseudos and christists. Venkat On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 11:01 AM, anjali deshpande <[EMAIL PROTECTED] com> wrote: Jharkhand Forum this comes straight from the heart! it was the best i have read yet in this 'academic' discussion. hindus don't convert because they don't which caste to prescribe to the convert. many years ago, in 1981 i think, a hand full of us activists, mostly women, had published a leaflet with a series of questions including one to the effect, 'if all hindus are one, will any dalit be allowed to become a shankaracharya?' we were distributing it at a rally of hindus at india gate in delhi when we were attacked, the clothes of one of our friends were torn off, the other was beaten up badly and they could escape only because a male activist friend joined the 'mob' and said 'hinduism prevents us from doing worse things to women so get away,' and an autorickshaw luckily came our way. these people are dangerous! in the northeast too the 'parivar' is trying hard to coopt 'tribal' gods, build temples where there are none (and why should there be if the people till now lived without needing them?) and christians are building churches (why is there any need for them if people managed without them for so long?). why should identity depend on some buildings devoted to some gods and some rituals? that is what we need to ask and we need to understand how the promotion of identity politics at the international level is being reflected and is stirring up the already murky waters of religious politics in our country. but that becomes academic too! i had begun this only to tell you how your response touched my heart. got carried away. anjali deshpande On 8/29/08, Cyprian Ekka <[EMAIL PROTECTED] co.in> wrote: Jharkhand Forum Please stop the 'academic' discussion. I am a born Christian, as you may guess from my name. And, hold your fanatic breath, I am a tribal too. Who should know better if my ancestors were Hindus or not? They never were. And I am proud they weren't (even if I weren't a Christian). I still follow my ancestral religion, customs and traditions. I pray to the 'tribal' God (sic) and Christian God too. Todate they have not quarelled with one another. Neither has the Church told me not to pray to a 'tribal' God. Why should anyone else have a problem with that? Incidently, I feel doubly fortunate not to have fallen prey to the Vanwasi Kalyan Ashramites, who seem to develp ulcer calling me an Adivasi. The Saffrons want me to 'return' to Hinduism, right? Watch out! Return, you said? What return? Where return? Who is the oldest dweller of the soil, the blood curdling fanatics or Adivasis? Is that not why my 'Adivasiyat' has been recycled into 'Vanvasiyat'? If I wish, I may embrace Hinduism right now (online, if Vedas certify it as valid). May I ask the Saffron brigage if they will grant me a Brahmin's status and make me the chief pujari at Puri temple or Akshardham temple or what have you? If yes, I may start typing an application letter right away. But don't tell me to hate other religions and their followers. That's not the Hinduism I may love to convert to. I studied Hinduism and several other Indian religions. None taught me to hate others. I can recite and comment on some shlokas of Bhagwadgeeta off the bat. I even meditate on them. I loved watching 'Ramayan' tele-serial and have already read the Hindu epics with relish. I love to participate in spiritual discourses of some Hindu sects (certainly not those sponsored by the Brigade). Which edition of Hinduism are you talking about? Cyprian Ekka --- __._,_ Jharkhand Forum Jharkhand Forum | Jharkhand Blog | Jharkhand Video | Jharkhand Network
