Linux-Misc Digest #377, Volume #20 Fri, 28 May 99 03:13:31 EDT
Contents:
Re: how to kill a dead process? (Marc Mutz)
Re: Bart or Lisa could keep the family running Linux (Tim Sutherland)
Re: Linux Crashed!? (brian moore)
[recruit] Creative C(oders) sought for Mud Project (Quaeris)
Re: Application/PDF in Netscape 4.51 (Peter Verthez)
Re: Netscape 4.60 evaluation (Michel)
Re: Netscape 4.60 evaluation (Michel)
Re: PS1 format (Peter Granroth)
Help! DOS Partition (Jeffrey Bannister)
Re: PPP under RedHat 6.0 (Michel)
The Glass Cathedral (Gilles Pelletier)
Re: Large CD-ROM file errors...? (brian moore)
Re: Large CD-ROM file errors...? (Peter Samuelson)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 20:41:36 +0200
From: Marc Mutz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: how to kill a dead process?
Sam Steingold wrote:
>
> how do I get rid of this process:
>
> USER PID %CPU %MEM VSZ RSS TTY STAT START TIME COMMAND
> sds 26725 0.0 1.3 4808 3532 pts/2 D 12:54 0:00
>/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i386-redhat-linux/egcs-2.91.66/cc1 /tmp/ccgcQxbp.i -
>
> (except by rebooting the machine, of course).
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
> Sam Steingold (http://www.goems.com/~sds) running RedHat6.0 GNU/Linux
> Micros**t is not the answer. Micros**t is a question, and the answer is Linux,
> (http://www.linux.org) the choice of the GNU (http://www.gnu.org) generation.
> Daddy, why doesn't this magnet pick up this floppy disk?
in 'top' hit k(ill) and use KILL for the signal (normally it's TERM,
which only asks the process more or less kindly to terminate itself....)
Or on the command line you could type `kill -9 <pid>`, i.e. 'kill -9
26725'
Marc
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tim Sutherland)
Subject: Re: Bart or Lisa could keep the family running Linux
Date: 28 May 1999 04:34:02 GMT
In article <7igq5e$uun$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Peter T. Breuer wrote:
>Jonas ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
>: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Gilles Pelletier) writes:
>
>: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (brian moore) =E9crivait/wrote:
>: >
>: > >> Indeed! And I'm glad to take your word for it: now I can say I know
>: > >> one of those rare birds. Still 99,999 to find. That's a lot.
<snip>
>99,996.
<snip>
99,995 now. Seriously, how many Linux users read comp.os.linux.misc? Obviously
there is going to be more than 100,000 people that use Linux and not Windows.
Let's add a whole lot of kernel hackers (Linus, Alan) etc, Rasterman, Miguel,
Raymond, RMS - many well known people that don't use Windows and do use Linux.
--
MOUNT TAPE U1439 ON B3, NO RING
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (brian moore)
Subject: Re: Linux Crashed!?
Date: 28 May 1999 05:54:35 GMT
On Tue, 25 May 1999 15:53:28 -0700,
Paul Wildrick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm hoping somebody out there can help me. My linux server has been
> crashing with this error.
>
> touch: /var/log/news/nntpsend.log: No such file or directory
> chmod: /var/log/news/nntpsend.log: No such file or directory
> /usr/lib/news/bin/nntpsend: /var/log/news/nntpsend.log: No such file or
> directory
> nntpsend: [13937] start
> nntpsend: [13937] stop
>
> The was the last email to the root account before it died. After that I
> can't log in.
> Any ideas?
Yes: disable services you don't need.
You're not running a news server, so you shouldn't be running scripts
for maintaining it.
That's all the above is (complaining that you're not running a news
server so the maintainance scripts don't run correctly).
That's not why your system crashed.
I would suggest you look at your hardware: specifically heat and memory.
--
Brian Moore | "The Zen nature of a spammer resembles
Sysadmin, C/Perl Hacker | a cockroach, except that the cockroach
Usenet Vandal | is higher up on the evolutionary chain."
Netscum, Bane of Elves. Peter Olson, Delphi Postmaster
------------------------------
From: Quaeris <*remove*[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.mud.programming,comp.gamesdevelopment.programming.algorithms,comp.programming
Subject: [recruit] Creative C(oders) sought for Mud Project
Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 22:43:33 -0700
We are a small group of dedicated role-players, hobbyists and fantasy
enthusiasts with a playful and mature vision for an extensible
text-based MUD system that will give us some very interesting
features, provide challenging, inspiring play that is easy to learn and
control.
We are looking for like-minded coders and builders to join us in
creating the seed from which our project is growing.
We -really- can use a good coder or two, please give us a shot!
Basics:
We are starting with the mordor 4.62 skeleton and have been at work for
about a year. We want to create a world that is a rich experience,
without being overbearing. To this end we are looking for very creative
and inspired builders with a sense of craft and attention to detail. We
will be adding scripting features to our capabilities soon.
We have some good basic web-resources set up to support builders and
coders.
Our Platform:
We have an always up server, a majordomo, a threaded web-based message
system running on Red Hat linux (intel). We use a DCS code tracking
system and have a good organizational structure within the project,
meaning there is web based recordkeeping and things are kept closely
updated within it, creating a resource for our coders. Mordor is a
fairly primitive codebase, familiarity with C is a must.
Our Goals:
We want to create an inspired and inspiring team that will allow us to
grow a fantasy-based role-playing environment that is rich, rewarding,
and fun to be a part of.
We are:
Organized, friendly, inspired and creative...
If you're looking to join a team with some interesting goals, and help
us create a great text-based mud, please send me some info on yourself,
what you're looking for, etc and we'll quickly set up some time to
chat.
Thanks!
Quaeris -
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: verthezp@nemdev1 (Peter Verthez)
Subject: Re: Application/PDF in Netscape 4.51
Date: 28 May 1999 05:55:29 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kaya Imre) writes:
: I downloaded and installed Acrobat4 and set it as an
: application to Netscape4.51. When I call a pdf file
: the acroread comes up but it cannot find the downloaded
: pdf file. If I search the cache directory and find it
: in a subdirectory there the I can read it fine.
:
: How could I do this automatically?
: -TIA
How did you set it as an application for Netscape 4.51 ?
The correct way is: acroread %s
You have to include the "%s", because that will be expanded to
the actual location of the downloaded pdf file.
Best regards,
Peter.
--
____________________________________________________________________
Peter Verthez mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Software Engineer Network Mgt. Tel: (+32 3) 451 28 14 | Alcanet:
Alcatel Telecom, dept. XE60 Fax: (+32 3) 451 28 03 | (6)2681
____________________________________________________________________
When you argue with a fool, chances are he is doing just the
same.
------------------------------
From: Michel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Netscape 4.60 evaluation
Date: 27 May 1999 11:51:05 -0500
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Michel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Chris Aiken wrote:
> >>
> >> I downloaded 4.6 from Netscape in the form of a gzipped tarball file.
> >> I installed in my /opt directory w/o any problems at all. I edited the
> >> /bin/netscape script to point to my new version being careful not to
> >> destroy the old version. It works great! No problems so far. It
> >> seems to be a bit faster that 4.51 but who knows. I did pick up
> >> new bookmarks and address books from my .netscape directory.
> >>
> > You must not have gone on java sites yet!
>
> > My netscape goes in a warp hole here, I have RedHat 6.0
>
> I've been to all the java sites I used to visit with netscape 4.51 and
> there were no probs with 4.6
>
> No considerable difference though. I just like to keep to the latest
> version although sometimes that's not necessarily a good idea.
>
> What problems are you having with java sites?
>
As soon as it is to start loading java stuff netscape vanishes and leaves only
a lock file. It basically kills netscape. If I go back to Netscape 4.5 it loads
the java stuff but eventually crashes netscape.
I have RedHat 6.0 with 40M of RAM, two swap partitions of 64M and lotsa hard disk
space.
300-400M, I have a Cyrix 686 230Mhz.
--
Tired of Windows' rebootive multitasking?
then try Linux's preemptive multitasking
http://www.netonecom.net/~bbcat/
We have software, food, music, news, search,
history, electronics and genealogy pages.
------------------------------
From: Michel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Netscape 4.60 evaluation
Date: 28 May 1999 01:03:35 -0500
Ed Young wrote:
>
> Michel wrote:
> >
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > >
> > > Michel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > Chris Aiken wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> I downloaded 4.6 from Netscape in the form of a gzipped tarball file.
> > > >> I installed in my /opt directory w/o any problems at all. I edited the
> > > >> /bin/netscape script to point to my new version being careful not to
> > > >> destroy the old version. It works great! No problems so far. It
> > > >> seems to be a bit faster that 4.51 but who knows. I did pick up
> > > >> new bookmarks and address books from my .netscape directory.
> > > >>
> > > > You must not have gone on java sites yet!
> > >
> > > > My netscape goes in a warp hole here, I have RedHat 6.0
> > >
> > > I've been to all the java sites I used to visit with netscape 4.51 and
> > > there were no probs with 4.6
> > >
> > > No considerable difference though. I just like to keep to the latest
> > > version although sometimes that's not necessarily a good idea.
> > >
> > > What problems are you having with java sites?
> > >
> >
> > As soon as it is to start loading java stuff netscape vanishes and leaves only
> > a lock file. It basically kills netscape. If I go back to Netscape 4.5 it loads
> > the java stuff but eventually crashes netscape.
> >
> > I have RedHat 6.0 with 40M of RAM, two swap partitions of 64M and lotsa hard disk
>space.
> > 300-400M, I have a Cyrix 686 230Mhz.
>
> Look for guava or kaffe installed as an rpm. If you find it get rid of it. I
> have seen where conflicts between java vm's have caused this bad behavior. Best
> of luck...
It is guavac, I removed both of them and it still crashes. The site that I get it to
crash quickly is Blue Mountains. If you don't have the address go on my web site where
I have a link near the bottom of the page.
You go to birthday and choose the one that says happy birthday somewhere near
the bottom on the right. It only takes a few second once it start load the page
to crash.
I do run a Javascript applet on my web site with no problem. The stuff that kills
netscape is the kind of java that runs on Blue Mountains. It could be their music
too but it is too quick to get an idea.
--
Tired of Windows' rebootive multitasking?
then try Linux's preemptive multitasking
http://www.netonecom.net/~bbcat/
We have software, food, music, news, search,
history, electronics and genealogy pages.
------------------------------
From: Peter Granroth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: PS1 format
Date: 25 May 1999 20:54:25 +0200
Cliff Story <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I looked through my growing collection of Linux books and the "Linux
> FAQ" and could not find the answer to this silly question:
>
> What is the format of the PS1 variable?
>
> I want to change my prompt to something like:
>
> tty2 clyde$
look in bash(1) (if you use bash) for the section on "prompting".
To get the above prompt, use:
export PS1="$(tty | cut -c6-) \W $ "
HTH
--
==================================
+ Peter Granroth +
+ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] +
+ http://soke.dhs.org +
==================================
------------------------------
From: Jeffrey Bannister <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Help! DOS Partition
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 14:00:01 +0800
I'm using RedHat Linux 5.1 on an old 486/33.
I stuck a big 4.3Gb HD on it but from dos fdisk, it couldn't see the
whole thing.
So I installed Linux, partitioned using Disk Druid and created a DOS
partition from there (Dos 16bit >=32M).However, Linux is fine but DOS
fdisk cannot read the partition table and bombs out.
Any suggestions?
At boot time, I am told that the FAT table is invalid, probably because
of using a different partitioning program.
Thanks in advance,
Jeff Bannister.
------------------------------
From: Michel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: PPP under RedHat 6.0
Date: 28 May 1999 01:07:26 -0500
Nick Birkett wrote:
>
> I upgraded RH5.2 -> RH6.0 . My bro did a complete new install to RH6.0.
> We both have the same problem. PPP thoughput has gone down from
> 4.5Kbyte/s (byte not bit) to
> 0.9 Kbyte/s.
>
> Had a play with changing cua01 -> ttyS1 etc. Recompiled kernel to 2.2.9.
> Recompiled ppp (drastic I know).
> Played with setserial, pppd options etc etc.
> Everthing else is same as before (under RH5.2).
>
> We use kppp (KDE app) to setup ppp connections (is this the problem ?).
>
So you managed to get this thing to work!
I used control-panel and my ftp downloads varies between 3.9k to 10k with
a 33k modem. If you were on winblows we could blame the winmodem but here
it is strange indeed. Maybe your scripts are connecting you at 1200 bauds,
who knows! I set mine to the 115k and it works down from there.
Did you compile the kernel with PPP in the kernel or modules? I never got my
PPP to work very well when it is in the kernel. I find out that it works best
as a module.
--
Tired of Windows' rebootive multitasking?
then try Linux's preemptive multitasking
http://www.netonecom.net/~bbcat/
We have software, food, music, news, search,
history, electronics and genealogy pages.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Gilles Pelletier)
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux
Subject: The Glass Cathedral
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 06:13:07 GMT
Of course, we all know where distributors' and system administritors'
moolah comes from: an inadequacy between the system offered and the
needs of the general public. There's absolutely not a shade of a doubt
that Linux, an OS that overwrites files without prompting, is not for
the casual user. This fact has been recognized by M$ at least since
DOS 3.
But how the hell, in this crocked world of ours, would "evangelist"
Eric Raymond admit making his dough in such an horrid way? I never
thought my hoax would stand for more than a few hours. How could the
clever Linux community not find out that I had made up the whole
second paragraph of my "Linux: 750 million users by 2004?" (See my
original posting below below.)
Bah! I don't know... maybe I would have been fooled myself, but I
would certainly have checked the original text. Raymond's true
pretension about Linux having 750 millions users in five years is just
too outrageous. Gee! Who would be left using Windows, save Gates,
Allen and Ballmer? I even thought Businessweek was putting on an hoax
of its own. How about this excerpt: " [Raymond writes an arithmetic
formula to determine this]" Does this sound serious?
Then I thought of Raymond's authoritative opus: The Cathedral and the
Bazaar.
http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/cathedral-bazaar.html
The big bangle there is in the sort of "Release Early, Release Often"
and "The Importance of Having Users", in other words, thoughts after
the fact on developing on the internet. How long does this go in the
way of describing the new structure of development as a "bazaar"?
As we all know, the odd numbered versions of the kernel -- 2.1, 2.3,
etc -- are development versions. People with some programming
experience can get their hands at it, adapt it to their hardware or
purpose, which wasn't possible before the internet and open source.
Isn't there inevitably a Cathedral structure in the development of any
OS? If you can't write a driver, it's very unlikely that you'll be
checking other people's work under Torvalds' supervision anytime soon.
The term "Glass Cathedral" would certainly describe this kind of
structure more appropriately, as you can learn from the code other
people write and the community can evaluate other people's skills.
As for the bazaar, I'm afraid it does exist, but it's rather in the
distribution scheme. It's Redhat saying "Of course, Linux is free!
Just don't forget if you lend your CD with BRU, you might get into
trouble" or "Too bad if you have Windows installed and Rockridge
extensions don't work! Why don't you buy our distribution with the
book?" or "You think our instructions lead you nowhere? Just call us,
we're strong on $ervice!" It's also Suse installing an Applix demo
(400 megs!) by default. It's all those Netscape-pl'ed and QT-pl'ed and
whoever-pl'ed licenses that spring from all over and are intertwined
with true GPL software, etc.
In terms of classic economy, this is a hell of a bazaar. At the
present time, euphoria seems the only politically correct attitude
towards this turmoil; I just hope it doesn't end up in a legal chivvy
like the world has never known.
For now, it seems to me Linux is going nowhere fast. It's not sound to
expect that we'll put the whole population into a sysadmin spirit.
People in general have other concerns and they will neither pay gurus
for support everytime a problem arises, nor roam usenet until they
find out which answer really makes sense. If users don't get a fairly
clear understanding of the basic structure and functionning of their
system, the game is lost for Linux.
I'm certainly not much of a Linux guru: after checking HOWTOs, minis
and maxis, and FAQs, I still haven't found out how to get the keyboard
I want for working at the prompt (CF). But I've got a feeling that
many other non-gurus share. Like investors, I believe that if the
present conditions prevail, Linux will be a passing fad. In ten years
from now, when bank transactions, home buying, car rentals, hotel
reservations, movie rentals, etc., will almost obligatorily go through
the internet, Linux will only be a nice geek's souvenir.
Of course, we know that Gates and Allen are selling their shares like
crazy, but is it that they're afraid Windows is loosing ground or are
they only getting more and more people economically interested in the
survival of Windows, while investing themselves in satellite and cable
networks, data and image banks, and all kind of rental services which,
of course, will all be Windows oriented?
Getting a better share of the server market for Linux won't do. The
ludicrous "Frontpage extentions"(1) have already helped M$ enter the
server market. Imagine what a wedge they're building now!
(1) But did the Linux community help understand the use of scripts?
Were simple scripts installed on servers so people could learn how to
use them, or were they only offered as "$upport" to commercial
accounts? (Some ISPs offer free pre-written scripts. But they're the
exception.)
More money and power is at stake here than at any other moment in
history and it's no use to expect the game will be played fairly: any
kind of manipulation is possible. Never-ending inquests could be
undertaken (1) to determine who's THE vilain and who's just a
simpleton in this silly game. It would be a terrible loss of time.
(1)For instance, how is it that AOL, who got along so well with M$,
finally bought Netscape?
The only thing that matters is the users base. People must feel that
Linux is not a geeks' toy, that they too can apprehend and comprehend
it. Pretending to turn the young generation into a bunch of Linux
geeks is talking nonsense: even if it was possible, it would happen
way too late.
Measures must be taken immediately to provide well-organised
information to people who want to get a basic knowledge of their
system, people who don't intend to become top-flight programmers but
don't want to get stuck in front a user interface when the first
problem arises(1). Otherwise, the Glass Cathedral will shatter.
(1) See: "AutoInstall is for experts, not beginners!!!" on
comp.os.linux.misc, for a possible way to achieve this goal.
Here's my previous posting. Figure out which hoax is the most
extravagant : )
=========
Linux: 750 million users by 2004?.
"I Want to Live in a World Where Software Doesn't Stink"
In a Q&A, Linux evangelist Eric Raymond talks about unseating
Microsoft as the OS of choice. (Businessweek)
(...)
Q: Five years from now, how many people will be using Linux?
A: If we continue to grow our user rate at the level we've been doing
now, [Raymond writes an arithmetic formula to determine this] we'd get
six doubling periods, which means just shy of a billion people, 860
million in fact. I'm not expecting it to be quite that high because
trends like this tend to show logistic growth rather than exponential,
and it's not clear what the threshold is. I'd say somewhere near 750
million would be a good conservative estimate.
(I made up the following paragraph.)
Q: A conservative estimate? Isn't Microsoft still thriving on selling
software? How can Linux survive giving away its own?
Something must be made clear here. Microsoft is selling software,
we're selling service. Let me give you an exemple. While working at
the prompt, whereas Windows asks before overwriting a file, Linux just
sends it to limbo. Though nowadays people rarely work at the prompt,
on some occasions, they have to. After loosing a few files this way,
they call support. We provide a little shell script and they're back
to heaven. Expect to see Linux prices skyrocketing in the next few
years.
(...)
Well, who am I to contradict such an "evangelist"? But I'd lay a bet:
if there ever is 750 million Linux users in 5 years from now, 90% of
them will still be booting Windows by default. Lilo's end isn't near.
Do read the whole story:
http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/apr1999/nf90427c.htm
GP
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (brian moore)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development.system
Subject: Re: Large CD-ROM file errors...?
Date: 28 May 1999 06:20:52 GMT
On Wed, 26 May 1999 08:09:01 +0100,
Mark Tranchant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Matt Starnes wrote:
> >
> > It might have something to do with filesystems. The software we use in
> > Windoze 95 defaults to create a Joliet filesystem on the CD-ROM which is I
> > believe different from the standard ISO9660 format. You might want to
> > reburn it and check that. Or you can compile Joilet support into your
> > kernel.
>
> Well, thanks for the effort, but to quote myself: "I booted up Linux
> 2.2.9, with full CD support including Joliet compiled in)"
And precisely how does Joliet handle such things as owners, permissions,
symlinks and other features of a typical Unix filesystem? We won't even
get into how device files would work on a Joliet CD.
You don't want to burn it in Joliet: sure, Linux will read it, but it
will be missing important things like symlinks and (probably why it
doesn't work) device files.
--
Brian Moore | "The Zen nature of a spammer resembles
Sysadmin, C/Perl Hacker | a cockroach, except that the cockroach
Usenet Vandal | is higher up on the evolutionary chain."
Netscum, Bane of Elves. Peter Olson, Delphi Postmaster
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Peter Samuelson)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development.system
Subject: Re: Large CD-ROM file errors...?
Date: 28 May 1999 01:56:00 -0500
Reply-To: Peter Samuelson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
[Mark Tranchant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>]
> > Well, thanks for the effort, but to quote myself: "I booted up
> > Linux 2.2.9, with full CD support including Joliet compiled in)"
[brian moore <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>]
> And precisely how does Joliet handle such things as owners,
> permissions, symlinks and other features of a typical Unix
> filesystem? We won't even get into how device files would work on a
> Joliet CD.
Of course. You wouldn't expect Microsoft to come up with something as
useful as Rock Ridge, now, would you? *They* don't have any use for
symlinks....
> You don't want to burn it in Joliet: sure, Linux will read it, but it
> will be missing important things like symlinks and (probably why it
> doesn't work) device files.
Bzzzt ... he burned a single 70MB tarfile, not a whole directory tree.
(Read the original post.) The issue is that Linux shows a truncated
(16MB) file instead of the whole thing. Needless to say, Windoze sees
the CD the way it wrote it.
--
Peter Samuelson
<sampo.creighton.edu!psamuels>
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Misc Digest
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