Dear David and All,
Strange discussion or rather no dscussion...
It's good point about today preference for a short appogiatura among
lutenists playing baroque music. Very often it sounds as if a
luteplayer were playing those small notes in Giuliani or Carulli ;-))
I don't know if it's reluctance to read historical sources or an
inert attachment to still alieve a simplified (!) XIXth C. musical
language.
But of course the ''baroque appogiatura'' is not only the long one --
there are places for a shor one too, but applied properly to the
context [... some are written out]
With appogiatura there is also a problem of an ''on beat'' or ''befor
beat'' one. Monteclair and other French ''general'' writers mention
both, and they have basically different harmonic implications, what
is obvious. Both are vital for melody instruments and singing (plus
perhaps harpsichord) but here lutenists are faced with a problem --
as the ''before beat'' type is almost impossible or a very tricky
one, beside of places of puraly monodic/melodic character.
But there is a whole range of other ornamentation devices, besides of
appogiatura (which is however a basic ingredient of many) and most
lutenists are theoreticaly well aware of them. For the earlier part
of the period sufice to remember of Mersenne or Mace [...], for later
obviously German sources with ''probably'' Felckenhagen in the
centre, not entirely removed from the French practices, I think. The
number of signs we see speaks for itself but it's probaby a tiny
representation of what was ''in fassion'' (!) at certain place and
times. Not only LONG or SHORT appogiatura for 150 or so years on the
whole European Continent plus Brittain and Colonies &ct... And lets
not forget about ornamenting with rythm (inequality) or dynamics
(forte-piano, ...) or other articulation or agogical or formal
devices (petit reprise, ...).
Of course ALL it's lost. For ever. Now we can only gess or propose
learned or inspired solutions, providing we are not lazy and try to
forget the famous ''one-note'' grace-notes ala Giuliani (as by some
famous... ;-)).
David gave good starting point. Now lets concentrate on the ''French
trill''.
J
_________
On 2009-01-29, at 13:37, David Tayler wrote:
Dear Jean-Marie,
Thanks for you detailed response.
I would be happy to refute your points one by one, but my main
point--in fact my only point, really--
that everyone is playing the ornament backwards, is the one you
don't discuss.
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