On Mon, 22 Jan 2001, Julian Aronowitz wrote:
> On Sun, Jan 21, 2001, at 11:37 AM, you wrote:
> > Hi Chris,
> >
> > >> If I want to use my computer hooked up to a different phone number,
> > >> than the one I used when I initialized Miami, but I still want to be
> > >> able to use Miami on the original phone number, how do I proceed?
> > >>
> > >> I ask the question, because, when I tried doing just that, I was not
> > >> able to connect through any of the ISP's I use.
> >
> > > Do the two numbers differ in the "features" they have? Say, for
> > > instance one has call waiting and the other dosen't? The only time that
> > > it would make sense that a logon "breaks" from a different number on the
> > > client side is when the server is using callback verification.
> >
> > It's possible that your ISP is using caller ID, and expecting you to
> > always call from the same number. I've come across this on one BBS.
That's sufficiently obnoxious that I doubt it's very common. Unless it
automatically captured the number the first time you called, you'd need to
tell the ISP the calling number explicitly.
Another possibility is that they use Caller ID only for logging purposes,
but refuse the call if Caller ID is blocked. In that case, you'd have to
include the Caller ID enable prefix (*82 in this area).
> > That's different from callback (where they ISP rings you back, after you
> > first dial in, and you do your internetting on the call that they make to
> > you). But, I'm not aware that Windows supports that, directly.
> >
> > I'd call the ISP, and check with them. And, if they're doing that, ask if
> > more than one number can be assigned to your account.
> >
> > It's also possible that one of your phone lines has a fault, or has other
> > equipment connected to it (phones, faxes, answering machines, burglar
> > alarms, etc.), that makes life too hard for your MODEM.
> >
> > > In either case, why not just run Miami init again, import the new
> > settings
> > > and save them with a different name/icon. Then just start Miami with the
> > > corresponding icon, depending on which line you are using.
> >
> > There shouldn't be any difference, unless your call is getting answered by
> > a different system at the ISP. Which isn't likely, unless your two
> > different numbers go through different exchanges, and your ISP has
> > different nodes that are automatically dialled depending on where the call
> > came from. Again, that's not likely on normal phone numbers, only the
> > special ones (e.g. companies that have national phone numbers, for
> > instance).
There are schemes something like that for ISP setups, but typically as a
way to reach the *same* server from *different* local numbers, which
wouldn't be likely to cause trouble.
> > > BTW, all that the "location" stuff in MS dialer does AFAIK, is to help
> > the
> > > dialer decide whether it needs to dial "1" and the area code. It really
> > > shouldn't have a bearing on any of the other settings. (with the
> > exception
> > > of callback type connections)
> >
> > Yes, things like knowing if your in an office, it needs to get an outside
> > line, and checking whether it needs to dial a long distance access code.
> > It does nothing else, that I know about.
Also, some ISP dialer packages keep a database of dialup numbers and can
pick the closest one based on the calling number. CompuServe has a hack
like this, for example. It's mainly useful for roaming laptops.
> I was able to eliminate the physical and conclude that it is
> Miami, because I remembered that, about a month ago, I visited a
> friend of mine, and brought my MS Windows powered notebook com-
> puter, to show him how to work with the Internet. (I will not
> go into the why's and wherefore's of his refusing to increase
> the RAM of his A2000 or A1200, to allow him to go on the Inter-
> net.) When I attached my computer to his phone line and tried
> to log into any one of my three dialup ISP's (MetConnect,
> MindSpring, and AmigaOnLine), I was not able to complete the
> process. The stacker-dialer ("Network-Dialup") refused doing it
> because it found a different "home" number than the one I had
> first typed in, when telling it where to dial. Once I added my
> friends number to the list, and told it that that was the current
> correct "home" number, I had no problems hooking up.
First of all, it doesn't follow that a problem with Windoze means a
problem with Miami. If that were true, Miami would really be a piece of
crap. :-)
Secondly, neither your modem nor Windoze has any means of determining the
actual calling number (although telephone exchanges have such a feature,
the number to access it is a jealously guarded secret, and it's a vocal
response anyway). Windoze can *only* go by what you tell it, and that can
*only* matter to the extent that it affects its own behavior. Most likely
it was an issue of whether to include the area code or not.
On Tue, 23 Jan 2001, Tim Seifert wrote:
>
> > As far as telephone lines go, the differences between my line and my
> > Dad's line and my friend's line, are the telephone exchanges and the
> > fact the only I have any special service -- call waiting. All three
> > have the same area code, as we all live within a few city blocks from
> > one another. The rest of the phone service is identical and provided by
> > the same company, plus, the calls to my ISP's are local calls. The one
> > thing I do, with phone numbers I call, is to add a prefix to disable my
> > call-waiting, while I am on the Internet. This prefix does nothing when
> > used with a line that does not have the call waiting service.
>
> Have you actually tested that? On one exchange here, if I use the call
> waiting disable code, where the exchange doesn't have that service, the
> exchange gives an error message. Which, of course, means the number
> dialed after the disable code never gets received by the exchange.
Exactly. Phone companies are terrible about screwing you for doing
something redundant, but not always consistently. Here it's an error to
dial the call-waiting disable code (*70) on my line that doesn't have call
waiting, but it accepts the Caller ID enable (*82) even though I don't
have Caller ID blocked.
Also, it used to be an error to use your own area code (redundantly), but
nowadays they accept it. I suspect this crock is the reason that some
dialers have hacks to compare the target area code with the selected
"home" area code to decide whether to include it.
> This is looking like the most likely cause of your problems. How far does
> Miami get through attempting to connect to the ISP, before it fails?
>
> Does the ISP answer the line?
>
> Does any handshaking occur?
>
> Does it get to the stage of logging on?
When all else fails, try connecting with a comm program. You should be
able to get connected to the termserver and see either some kind of login
prompt or a bunch of strange stuff starting with a tilde (a PPP frame).
> > I do remember that you must type in your own phone number, when you run
> > the Miami Init program. I just wanted to know whether there were a fast
> > and easy work around, other than run ning that program again?
>
> Nup, you don't. You type in the number for the ISP you're dialling, not
> your own phone number.
I just did a test run of MiamiInit, and there was no mention of entering a
calling number, even for callback purposes. This means that either:
1) MiamiInit only asks about callback if PPP negotiations indicate that
it's needed.
or
2) MiamiInit doesn't support callback at all, and you have to configure it
in Miami(Dx) directly if you need to use it.
IIRC Holger mentioned something about coding callback "blind" without an
ISP to test it with. That tends to suggest #2.
The bottom line is that the problem is most likely a "service difference"
between the lines, but you should be able to sort that out by seeing how
far it gets.
Fred Wright
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