Todd was flat out incorrect when he made this quote: "Charges
against Jaime were dropped by the court as there was no evidence to
bring a case against him."
That is not what happened at all, and I believe he knows it.
----- Original Message -----
From: <mailto:ddilts...@mchsi.com>Dale Dilts
To: <mailto:MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU>MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2010 9:12 PM
Subject: Re: [MOPO] 3rd Party Grading Comes to Posters
Jaime got a pass through legal system plain and simple. Its like
saying, I was creating fake hundred dollar bills to see how good I
could get them, but honestly judge, I never intended them to be used
for real currency.
No one, and I mean NO ONE, would spend the time and effort it took
to create these unless there is something to be gained in their bank
account somewhere. Anyone that is supporting Jaime as having one
pulled over on him is putting the shades on themselves plain and simple.
----------
From: MoPo List [mailto:mop...@listserv.american.edu] On Behalf Of
Sean Linkenback
Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2010 8:02 PM
To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
Subject: Re: [MOPO] 3rd Party Grading Comes to Posters
While Kerry may have been the mastermind, the "creator" - as in the
actual creator of the fakes is/was Jaime.
The gun analogy is a poor one, as I agree that there is nothing
inherently wrong with asking someone to make a fake (suspicious -
yes, wrong - no), but once Jaime found out that the fakes were in
the marketplace and being marketed as originals, he had a
responsibility to not only inform the people who had sent him fakes
for inspection/further work that they were fakes, but a moral
obligation of declining to produce further copies.
Yet he did neither of these things and continued to make them until
the fraud became public knowledge.
So maybe a better analogy is: if you were 100% certain that a
person you sold a gun to last week committed murder with that gun,
and that they also committed murder with a gun you sold them two
weeks ago, would you sell them another gun when they came into your
store this week and asked for one?
----- Original Message -----
From: <mailto:toddfeier...@msn.com>Todd Feiertag
To: <mailto:MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU>MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2010 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: [MOPO] 3rd Party Grading Comes to Posters
Virtually everyone in the hobby was fooled...
Jim,
I WASN'T FOOLED!!
And there were a lot of other knowledgeable collectors who weren't
fooled either. Again, you don't know what you're talking about.
If John was so concerned and wanted to "help the industry" so much,
he shouldn't have charged $175. plus, to authenticate each item. I
guess you also think Carol Tincup was another person who was trying
to "help the industry" when she charged you $350. an item.
Jim, there were many collectors who sent me posters and lobby cards
to authenticate. Do you know how much I charged them?? $00.00,
ZERO, NADDA, NOTHING. Now, you tell me, who's really trying to
"help the industry" or help out collectors, John and Carol??
Yet, you still support the creator of this entire mess.
I know you're referring to Jaime but the creator of this mess was
your good buddy Kerry and Kerry alone.
Charges against Jaime were dropped by the court as there was no
evidence to bring a case against him.
Again, I'll give you this analogy...
If I own a gun shop and sell someone a gun and they go out and kill
10 people, is the gun shop owner liable?? NO. Is the gun
manufacturer liable?? NO.
Guess who's liable?? The guy who decided to break the law and kill
10 people, that's who's responsible, not the gun shop owner and not
the gun manufacturer.
How come you didn't bring a lawsuit against Anthony in New
York?? After all, Anthony is the one who actually did the
printing. I haven't seen you mention anything about him?? If Jaime
is responsible, Anthony should also be just as responsible.
Jim, as much as you'd like the gun shop owner to be responsible for
the deaths of those 10 people, he's not the one.
Differences aside...I feel real bad for you Jim, since your loss in
this situation is by far the biggest and far worse than anybody
elses and honestly, I hope that you eventually get every penny
back. I can also understand your frustration and how stressful this
has been on you and your family losing so much money and I can also
understand you want anyone that had anything to do with this held
accountable and I don't blame you one bit. I just hope that this
gets resolved and resolved to your benefit 100%.
Todd
----------
Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 18:25:11 -0400
From: jimgres...@hotmail.com
Subject: Re: [MOPO] 3rd Party Grading Comes to Posters
To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
Todd what you aren't saying is that he repaired that Dracula Window
card prior to this fake problem surfacing. No one suspected
anything. All approaches changed when it was discovered the hobby
had a bad problem. Virtually everyone in the hobby was fooled, not
just John. And when awareness of the problem surfaced, John and
others then took a different look at things. Yet, you still support
the creator of this entire mess. It seems pretty ironic that on one
hand you support the 100% creator of fakes, but hammer on the guy
trying to help this industry.
Jim Gresham
18501 Henry Ct.
Ray, Mi 48096
586 677-7669
Go to <http://www.childrenofthenightbook.com/>www.childrenofthenightbook.com
----------
Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 18:17:47 -0400
From: toddfeier...@msn.com
Subject: Re: [MOPO] 3rd Party Grading Comes to Posters
To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
Not only did John Davis at Poster Mountain say a FAKE Dracula Window
Card was real after he re-restored it, he also swore a Dracula
REPRINT One Sheet was also real.
Those are two examples most people know about. Curious to know how
many other FAKES he also swore were real.
On the other hand, since he is obviously no expert, I'm curious to
know how many REAL posters and lobby cards he swore as being FAKE??
Just because someone restores posters, doesn't make them an expert
in authenticating them.
In addition, just because someone has handled a lot of posters,
doesn't make them an expert either.
Todd Feiertag
----------
Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 22:06:24 +0100
From: evan...@blueyonder.co.uk
Subject: Re: [MOPO] 3rd Party Grading Comes to Posters
To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
It is indeed interesting.
And if they have the right skills and knowledge it could have helped
if they started two years.
But, I still can't get over that someone seemingly had everything at
their disposal and still missed one fake in particular.
Correct me if this is account is inaccurate, but if you strip the
false front from a Window Card back, to improve and replace the
back, and you've years of experience of handling paper, how can you miss it?
I'm not hinting anything untoward, I just still can't understand it.
And if they couldn't spot that one, what level of skills and
knowledge are required for us to rely on anyone to prevent any
possible next generation?
Cheers,
Richard
On 26 May 2010, at 21:46, Sean Linkenback wrote:
For a long time now, 3rd party grading has been rumored to be "just
around the corner", "coming soon" and sometimes "never will happen".
Well that day is finally upon us for better or worse (though I can't
help but wonder if it had been here even two years ago would
collectors have saved literally millions of dollars and maybe the
"Universal Horror Fakes" fiasco might have been over as soon as it started.)
CGC (Certified Grading Company - the people who have been grading
comics for over a decade) has recently begun limited certification
of lobby cards to test the market and the first examples will be
offered at the upcoming Heritage Signature Auction in July.
Although no photos are on Heritage's site yet, there are two
listings for complete lobby sets (Let It Be, and All The King's Men)
that have been CGC graded/certified.
It will be very interesting to see how these are accepted in the marketplace.
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