On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 5:44 PM, Rob Weir <robw...@apache.org> wrote: > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:36 PM, Roberto Galoppini <rgalopp...@geek.net> > wrote: >> On Tue, Apr 17, 2012 at 7:08 PM, Alexandro Colorado <j...@apache.org> wrote: >> >>> On 4/17/12, drew <d...@baseanswers.com> wrote: >>> > On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 11:15 -0500, Alexandro Colorado wrote: >>> >> My point is that we are going to be bombarded with support questions, >>> >> regardless if we choose not to, is not up to us. >>> >> >>> >> Sure you can redirect them to the ML/Forums, but that would be done >>> >> 99% of the time, which will frustrate the user and the handlers. >>> >> >>> >> That's the point I wanted to make based on the experience of handling >>> >> these accounts in the past. >>> >> >>> >> Like I said, I am more concern with solving the issue of operation >>> >> first than figuring out which new accounts to create and why/why not. >>> > >>> > Well, I am not advocating removal of any existing accounts. >>> >>> I am sure you didn't. That is not what I said. >>> >> >> Hi Alexandro and all, >> >> Will @openofficeorg be under the Apache OpenOffice control? If this is the >> case, I wonder if it wouldn't be better to use that one instead of the new >> ones. In case I'd recommend to upload the new logo, as well as to update >> the short description. >> > > We've tried to contact the owner of @openofficeorg, to discuss putting > this account under PPMC control. We have no had success with that. So > we're going forward with a new account. It should be easy and quick > to get a similar number of followers once we promote it on the > homepage.
They're using the Apache OpenOffice label, people will get confused, this is unfortunate. Wonder if Apache trademark policies allow them to do so, though. > >> >>> >>> > What I am advocating is the creation of a set un-ambiguous official >>> > Apache OpenOffice project accounts. >>> >>> what will happened when the unambigous official account get support >>> inquiries everyday? >>> >> >> I had a look at the flow of questions and answers, it seems manageable to >> me. >> >> >> >>> >>> > >>> > I believe that there is work needing to be done to establish the Apache >>> > OpenOffice identity. >>> > >>> > It seems to me that this is an appropriate step to further that goal. >>> >> >> Here my list of recommendations: >> >> 1. Rebranding existing accounts (see above) >> 2. Spend some time to choose (few) people to follow (maybe using keywords >> like office suites, odf, open standards, etc). >> As of today only Alexandro and Rob are followed by @openofficeorg, >> think we should spend some time to choose people to follow, so that it >> could be easier to engage in conversations using tools like googlefinder, >> Listorious, etc. > > That is an interesting point. Many people decide who to follow based > on recommendation engines that look at existing following patterns in > Twitter. So having a good set of mutual followers will help. > >> 3. Start simple. So announcements, news from our blog, new committers, etc. >> 4. Be consistent. Two message a day could be a good starting point, maybe >> once a day over the week-ends. >> 5. Don't follow back just for the sake of it, it's wise to follow only >> people we might want to engage with. >> 6. Start conversations with people we know, related projects, etc. > > For example, we might congratulate other OSS projects,Apache and > external, that make new releases, if these would be of interest to our > followers. And we could join conversations taking place in the open standards world if somehow related to ODF, etc. For example Andy Updegrove has now a twitter account, he might be someone to follow and to engage with. Roberto > >> 7. Establish a clear policy about language style, but especially for how to >> handle "crises" >> 8. Use a tool to measure our improvements, both Klout and PeerIndex may be >> useful in this respect. >> >> Roberto >> >> >>> >>> Sure I agree, but my point is really about how to do it based on >>> previous issues. >>> >>> > >>> > //drew >>> > >>> >> >>> >> On 4/17/12, drew <d...@baseanswers.com> wrote: >>> >> > On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 11:02 -0500, Alexandro Colorado wrote: >>> >> >> I think this provide a bit of confussion on the user end. Also I >>> >> >> recognize the struggle of keeping the accounts active. Making >>> multiple >>> >> >> accounts will increase the job. >>> >> >> >>> >> >> The blog itself has not been updated that frequently, and I am not >>> >> >> sure if this will increase as we get a release. >>> >> >> >>> >> >> Most of the use of the accounts on my experience is support-like >>> >> >> issues. So relying on one single point of contact is also pretty bad. >>> >> >> >>> >> >> Having an AOO-Support and AOO-Annoucement is equally not good >>> strategy >>> >> >> in my account because people will tend to stick to the account that >>> >> >> they see crossing their path. (Just because we structure one way, >>> >> >> doesnt mean users will do so). >>> >> >> >>> >> >> One of the issues of openofficeorg accounts both on Facebook Google >>> >> >> plus and twitter had been the issue of keeping the content fresh and >>> >> >> also interacting as a group as opposed to an individual. >>> >> >> >>> >> >> I would argue to stop taking liberties on creating new accounts and >>> >> >> instead take liberties on designing a good strategy to solve some of >>> >> >> these basic issues that tackle these problems. >>> >> >> >>> >> >> So far I am not even sure how these accounts could be handle by >>> >> >> infrastructure and what are the requirements. Rob mention that >>> >> >> infrastructure should manage these, but I am also not sure how long >>> >> >> will they take to proxy the messages specially when it comes to >>> >> >> support and we get 100 inquiries a day (for example). >>> >> > >>> >> > Hi Alexandro, >>> >> > >>> >> > Good points - I would simply emphasize that I am not at all saying >>> that >>> >> > the apacheoo accounts should be about support - not at all. >>> >> > >>> >> > The ApacheOO accounts (lets focus on just twitter and identi.ca) for >>> a >>> >> > moment - would be used specifically as a broadcast mechanism. >>> >> > >>> >> > How I as envisioning it, at least. >>> >> > >>> >> > //drew >>> >> > >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> On 4/17/12, drew <d...@baseanswers.com> wrote: >>> >> >> > On Mon, 2012-04-16 at 00:50 -0400, drew wrote: >>> >> >> >> On Sun, 2012-04-15 at 18:25 -0400, Rob Weir wrote: >>> >> >> >> > On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 12:08 PM, drew <d...@baseanswers.com> >>> >> >> >> > wrote: >>> >> >> >> > > On Wed, 2012-04-11 at 17:43 +0200, Roberto Galoppini wrote: >>> >> >> >> > >> On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 4:09 PM, Rob Weir < >>> robw...@apache.org> >>> >> >> >> > >> wrote: >>> >> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > Social media outreach, via Twitter, Facebook, Google+, >>> etc., >>> >> >> >> > >> > is >>> >> >> >> > >> > an >>> >> >> >> > >> > important part of outreach to users. Although the Apache >>> >> >> >> > >> > developer >>> >> >> >> > >> > community is firmly rooted in mailing lists, we know that >>> our >>> >> >> >> > >> > users >>> >> >> >> > >> > live in a different world. If we want to engage with them >>> >> >> >> > >> > we >>> >> >> >> > >> > need >>> >> >> >> > >> > to >>> >> >> >> > >> > use the tools that they use, and communicate the way they >>> >> >> >> > >> > communicate. >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> > Now that we're very close to the AOO 3.4 release, I'd like >>> to >>> >> >> >> > >> > start >>> >> >> >> > >> > with a project Twitter account, under PPMC control. >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> > By "under PPMC control" I mean something similar to how we >>> >> >> >> > >> > treat >>> >> >> >> > >> > the >>> >> >> >> > >> > project blog: >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> > -- Any PPMC member, upon request, can have write access. >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> > -- We can use the project's official logo in conjunction >>> with >>> >> >> >> > >> > the >>> >> >> >> > >> > account. >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> > -- We would promote the account on our project's website. >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> > -- We would generally treat the account as an official >>> voice >>> >> >> >> > >> > of >>> >> >> >> > >> > the >>> >> >> >> > >> > project, not as a personal account. >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> > I'm not saying we need to pre-review and and approve every >>> >> >> >> > >> > "tweet" >>> >> >> >> > >> > sent through the account. But we should set expectations >>> >> >> >> > >> > that >>> >> >> >> > >> > the >>> >> >> >> > >> > account is to be used in a professional fashion, upholding >>> >> >> >> > >> > the >>> >> >> >> > >> > standards of this project, not used to settle personal >>> >> >> >> > >> > disputes, >>> >> >> >> > >> > to >>> >> >> >> > >> > promote personal business, etc. >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> >> > >> An option could be to agree on a simple guideline for that, >>> so >>> >> >> >> > >> that >>> >> >> >> > >> everyone knows how to handle it. I'm thinking not only about >>> >> >> >> > >> the >>> >> >> >> > >> style of >>> >> >> >> > >> communication, but also about who to follow, how to engage in >>> >> >> >> > >> conversations, improve outreach, etc. >>> >> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > There are already several Twitter accounts that use the OOo >>> >> >> >> > >> > name >>> >> >> >> > >> > or >>> >> >> >> > >> > trademarks: >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> > http://twitter.com/#!/openofficeorg --- This account has >>> >> >> >> > >> > 1571 >>> >> >> >> > >> > followers. But it is not sharing any AOO status, no links >>> to >>> >> >> >> > >> > blog >>> >> >> >> > >> > posts, announcements, etc. Who controls it? Are >>> >> >> >> > >> > we able to get it under PPMC control? Can we rebrand it as >>> >> >> >> > >> > Apache >>> >> >> >> > >> > OpenOffice? >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> >> > >> That could be a good starting point, I think. It seems like >>> if >>> >> >> >> > >> you're >>> >> >> >> > >> the >>> >> >> >> > >> only one who can send DM to the actual owner's account. >>> >> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> > http://twitter.com/#!/openoffice -- This account seems >>> >> >> >> > >> > unused. >>> >> >> >> > >> > Only one >>> >> >> >> > >> > tweet. >>> >> >> >> > >> > >>> >> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> >> > >> I'd try to get that it too. It's better than ApacheOO, and >>> you >>> >> >> >> > >> might >>> >> >> >> > >> want >>> >> >> >> > >> to put the full name in the Settings > Account > Name. >>> >> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> >> > > Hi Roberto, Rob >>> >> >> >> > > >>> >> >> >> > > I just did so now, and followed up with an email to the >>> account >>> >> >> >> > > contact >>> >> >> >> > > in the whois database for the domain listed, the linked >>> >> >> >> > > sub-domain >>> >> >> >> > > has >>> >> >> >> > > been dead for a while IIRC, though the main site is alive - >>> >> >> >> > > anyway, >>> >> >> >> > > I'll >>> >> >> >> > > report back when (or if) I hear anything back. >>> >> >> >> > > >>> >> >> >> > >>> >> >> >> > Hi Drew, >>> >> >> >> > >>> >> >> >> > It has been 5 days now. Have you received any response from >>> that >>> >> >> >> > domain >>> >> >> >> > owner? >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> No nothing. >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> > >>> >> >> >> > If not, I'm ready to go with a new account: >>> >> >> >> > https://twitter.com/#!/apacheoo >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> a good account name for an announcement stream, even with the >>> other >>> >> >> >> IMO. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > Howdy all, >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > Wanted to follow up on this. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > As I think about, IMO, this is a good moment to use a new >>> account(s) >>> >> >> > for >>> >> >> > a more formal, account of record if you will, for the project; >>> Apache >>> >> >> > OpenOffice. The use of the apache in the account name makes very >>> good >>> >> >> > sense to me for this purpose. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > The flip side of that then would be to treat the existing social >>> >> >> > media >>> >> >> > account as more community, less formal, voices. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > Anyawy - the apacheoo does get my vote for an appropriate name, for >>> >> >> > the >>> >> >> > project account. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > I took the liberty then to register the same name with the >>> identi.ca >>> >> >> > network. >>> >> >> > http://identi.ca/apacheoo >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > IMO identi.ca, which has a smaller user base then twitter, >>> represents >>> >> >> > an >>> >> >> > important target group to the project. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > The two accounts, if we use them for this, should be tied together. >>> >> >> > Certainly at the level that a post to the identi.ca should >>> >> >> > automatically >>> >> >> > broadcast to the twitter network. (easy to do) >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > A couple of thoughts on 'formal account of record': >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > Would recommend that the accounts not be used to follow lots of >>> other >>> >> >> > accounts. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > The accounts should not be used to re-tweet others messages. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > The accounts should _not_ be used for auto-generated scheduled >>> >> >> > postings. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > The accounts do need to be used on a regular basis to build up >>> >> >> > followers. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > Ability to 'follow' the accounts needs to be easily done within the >>> >> >> > main >>> >> >> > web infrastructure and there should be some naturally well fitting >>> >> >> > locations where that can be done. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > Anyone using the accounts should remember to keep the message >>> focused >>> >> >> > to >>> >> >> > the project. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > Well, that's a good spot to shutup huh :-) and let folks add their >>> >> >> > wisdom here. >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > So what you think - Use the new ApacheOO accounts? >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > Thanks, >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > //drew >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> //drew >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> > I have it configured with the BirdHerd service, so up to 10 PPMC >>> >> >> >> > members will be able send tweets via that account. >>> >> >> >> > >>> >> >> >> > -Rob >>> >> >> >> > >>> >> >> >> > >>> >> >> >> > > //drew >>> >> >> >> > > >>> >> >> >> > > >>> >> >> >> > > <snip> >>> >> >> >> > > >>> >> >> >> > >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Alexandro Colorado >>> OpenOffice.org Español >>> http://es.openoffice.org >>> >> >> ==== >> This e- mail message is intended only for the named recipient(s) above. 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